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Post by karl on Mar 31, 2020 20:32:24 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2020 4:06:38 GMT
Clovis Merovingian The Normans were themselves just Scandinavians speaking French! If the Germans and Scandinavians were so similar thenA) What on Earth was all the fighting about? B) Why has there always been a border between Denmark and Saxon Germany? C) Why does that border exist still today when quite different cultures like France and even Spain are part of European 'Greater Germany'? But that you think the Normans were not Scandinavian is woefully bad history. It never was about genetic difference, even though as lamburk points out, there is still significant difference anyways.As it is you miss the entire point of my Viking rant: There is a vast difference culturally as regards the ethic of a shared responsibility, and that of hierarchical domination which culminated in ww2 which always was an extension of those cultural clashes going back into the mists of time, and no doubt into the future too! Ultimately its the difference between humour and angst. Now go get a haircut, shine your shoes, count your money and make your women cover-up their hair in subservience to your domineering attitude, yer Sassenach bastard! har! har! It is there, vikings trace their roots from asia minor people, that's what poetic eddas talk about. While, anglo saxons, have roots from german people. May be, later on, the kings have inter married with each other, so that may have gone. but when vikings emerged, they only maintained the customs of indo-europeans, and called themselves aseirs or descendants from the men of asia. anyways, vikings never called themselves superior. It was hitler who promoted this nordic supremacy.
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Clovis Merovingian
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Apr 5, 2020 4:31:24 GMT
It is there, vikings trace their roots from asia minor people, that's what poetic eddas talk about. While, anglo saxons, have roots from german people. May be, later on, the kings have inter married with each other, so that may have gone. but when vikings emerged, they only maintained the customs of indo-europeans, and called themselves aseirs or descendants from the men of asia. anyways, vikings never called themselves superior. It was hitler who promoted this nordic supremacy. Germans have cultural (and some genetic) roots from Scandinavia. The Germanic tribes originated in Scandinavia and spread south into Germany conquering and assimilating the native Celtic tribes there. There ARE alot of Nordic Germans in the northernmost part of Germany where the Scandinavian Germanics wiped out the tribes living there. In Southern Germany the people there have more of an alpine look because these places were settled after the Roman empire moved out and the Germanic tribes assimilated and interbred with these people rather than exterminating them. There is also a huge Slavic influence from the east. The part about Asia minor people being the Aesir was Snorri Sturluson trying to give the gods in the Prose Edda a nobler origin than being demons which the Christians of the time believed they were so it would be palatable to a Christian audience. The only real difference between the Vikings and other Germanic people in the later parts of the Dark Ages were that the other Germanics were close in proximity to the Celtic and Latin peoples of western Europe and were Christianized far earlier and developed state apparatuses far earlier (the Germans were forced out of a tribal existence after being conquered by Charlemagne's empire and being turned into feudal serfs by him). Scandinavia was in the Northern periphery of Europe so still retained Germanic paganism and the worship of Thor, Odin, Frey, Tyr and the rest. This spread of Germanic culture and genes can be seen from this map. As you can see the core of Germanic Y DNA is in Scandinavia and spreads throughout Germany and later to England and Eastern Lowland Scotland. The video below gives a good history of the Germans. Start from 1:06 if you want to get to the point.
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Clovis Merovingian
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Apr 5, 2020 4:46:48 GMT
Clovis Merovingian The Normans were themselves just Scandinavians speaking French! If the Germans and Scandinavians were so similar thenA) What on Earth was all the fighting about? B) Why has there always been a border between Denmark and Saxon Germany? C) Why does that border exist still today when quite different cultures like France and even Spain are part of European 'Greater Germany'? But that you think the Normans were not Scandinavian is woefully bad history. It never was about genetic difference, even though as lamburk points out, there is still significant difference anyways. As it is you miss the entire point of my Viking rant: There is a vast difference culturally as regards the ethic of a shared responsibility, and that of hierarchical domination which culminated in ww2 which always was an extension of those cultural clashes going back into the mists of time, and no doubt into the future too! Ultimately its the difference between humour and angst. Now go get a haircut, shine your shoes, count your money and make your women cover-up their hair in subservience to your domineering attitude, yer Sassenach bastard! har! har! Not just that, but vikings also had culture, similar to an OLD INDO EUROPEAN, which was fire worshipping. Arabs had labelled these vikings pagan with a derogatory term, known as al majoos, or heathens or fire worshippers, which was a tradition maintaintained by the zoroastrians also. As far as I know, germans never worshpped fire deities Germans worshipped the exact same gods as the Scandinavians by different names. Donar is Thor, Wodan is Odin etc. www.artandpopularculture.com/Continental_Germanic_mythologySome names of the gods are listed below in each of their languages.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2020 14:14:50 GMT
Not just that, but vikings also had culture, similar to an OLD INDO EUROPEAN, which was fire worshipping. Arabs had labelled these vikings pagan with a derogatory term, known as al majoos, or heathens or fire worshippers, which was a tradition maintaintained by the zoroastrians also. As far as I know, germans never worshpped fire deities Germans worshipped the exact same gods as the Scandinavians by different names. Donar is Thor, Wodan is Odin etc. www.artandpopularculture.com/Continental_Germanic_mythologySome names of the gods are listed below in each of their languages. I am not denying it, because pre christianity anglo saxon tribes were woden worshippers. Beowulf novel depicts the entire details about anglo saxon kings. My point is, if germans of today were worshippers of these central asian ruling classes, as these are german names of those war lords, then, why have they succumbed to jews and have angela merkel as chancellor, who is completely a liberal, feiminist, pro third world immigration? Germany has the highest number of arabic, syrians and turkish muslim immigrants.
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Clovis Merovingian
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Apr 14, 2020 21:16:59 GMT
I am not denying it, because pre christianity anglo saxon tribes were woden worshippers. Beowulf novel depicts the entire details about anglo saxon kings. My point is, if germans of today were worshippers of these central asian ruling classes, as these are german names of those war lords, then, why have they succumbed to jews and have angela merkel as chancellor, who is completely a liberal, feiminist, pro third world immigration? Germany has the highest number of arabic, syrians and turkish muslim immigrants. Scandinavia itself is one of the most liberal, feminist, pro third world immigration places on the planet (except for Denmark which got sick of the immigration). Sweden is absolutely psychotically liberal.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2020 6:49:41 GMT
I am not denying it, because pre christianity anglo saxon tribes were woden worshippers. Beowulf novel depicts the entire details about anglo saxon kings. My point is, if germans of today were worshippers of these central asian ruling classes, as these are german names of those war lords, then, why have they succumbed to jews and have angela merkel as chancellor, who is completely a liberal, feiminist, pro third world immigration? Germany has the highest number of arabic, syrians and turkish muslim immigrants. Scandinavia itself is one of the most liberal, feminist, pro third world immigration places on the planet (except for Denmark which got sick of the immigration). Sweden is absolutely psychotically liberal. which means, vikings were not born from the INDO EUROPEAN ruling classes, but emulated these gods for strange reasons. So all proclaim of hitler's nordic supremacy were bullshirt, because, indo europeans were not blue eye blonde haired.
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Post by jonbain on Apr 15, 2020 16:52:00 GMT
lamburkThe entire concept of 'Germany' was a fabrication of the Prussians after they defeated Austria in the 1800's, and then set about trying to assimilate Denmark too. But that failed as the Danes never wanted to be part of any Reich. Languages before the 1800's were never as distinctly separate as they are today, with a spectrum of dialects stretching across all nations. Even today, people on the borders between nations speak a mixture of both in most old-world situations. So the decision to be or not to be 'German' is not at all cast in stone, but purely a construct. Those who perpetuate the sheer myth of Scandinavians being Germanic are really just suckers for Nazi propaganda. That border between Denmark, and the Saxons is older and more rigid than just about any border in the world. Even if the borders of the Saxons themselves have shifted radically so much over the centuries that you can find the world 'Saxon' wandering around all over the maps over the ages. Still, that border between Europe and Scandinavia runs like a roman wall through the bottom of the Jutland peninsula. Culturally they are as separate as any two cultures can be. And such decisions to be or not be part of another's empire is always based on transcendent ethics.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2020 17:17:25 GMT
lamburk The entire concept of 'Germany' was a fabrication of the Prussians after they defeated Austria in the 1800's, and then set about trying to assimilate Denmark too. But that failed as the Danes never wanted to be part of any Reich. Languages before the 1800's were never as distinctly separate as they are today, with a spectrum of dialects stretching across all nations. Even today, people on the borders between nations speak a mixture of both in most old-world situations. So the decision to be or not to be 'German' is not at all cast in stone, but purely a construct. Those who perpetuate the sheer myth of Scandinavians being Germanic are really just suckers for Nazi propaganda. That border between Denmark, and the Saxons is older and more rigid than just about any border in the world. Even if the borders of the Saxons themselves have shifted radically so much over the centuries that you can find the world 'Saxon' wandering around all over the maps over the ages.Still, that border between Europe and Scandinavia runs like a roman wall through the bottom of the Jutland peninsula. Culturally they are as separate as any two cultures can be. And such decisions to be or not be part of another's empire is always based on transcendent ethics. Now I have finally understood the reason for the conversion of the anglo saxons, and finally the scandinavians, as they were warring tribes against each other. The point about the border being very rigid is this - both of these tribes tried to proclaimed their descendancy from the odin, they both have similar mythos. however, the talk here clearly has shown that the OLD CENTRAL ASIAN RULING CLASSES did not breed with any girls. they rather united these regions into their kingdoms, and when their rule got finished, the aristocrats or elite groups, under the CENTRAL ASIAN KINGDOMS, tried to establish their hegemony, and warred against each other. So all talk of genetics, DNA,bloodlines are non sensical.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2020 17:34:18 GMT
Germans have cultural (and some genetic) roots from Scandinavia. The Germanic tribes originated in Scandinavia and spread south into Germany conquering and assimilating the native Celtic tribes there. There ARE alot of Nordic Germans in the northernmost part of Germany where the Scandinavian Germanics wiped out the tribes living there. In Southern Germany the people there have more of an alpine look because these places were settled after the Roman empire moved out and the Germanic tribes assimilated and interbred with these people rather than exterminating them. There is also a huge Slavic influence from the east. The part about Asia minor people being the Aesir was Snorri Sturluson trying to give the gods in the Prose Edda a nobler origin than being demons which the Christians of the time believed they were so it would be palatable to a Christian audience. The only real difference between the Vikings and other Germanic people in the later parts of the Dark Ages were that the other Germanics were close in proximity to the Celtic and Latin peoples of western Europe and were Christianized far earlier and developed state apparatuses far earlier (the Germans were forced out of a tribal existence after being conquered by Charlemagne's empire and being turned into feudal serfs by him). Scandinavia was in the Northern periphery of Europe so still retained Germanic paganism and the worship of Thor, Odin, Frey, Tyr and the rest. This spread of Germanic culture and genes can be seen from this map. As you can see the core of Germanic Y DNA is in Scandinavia and spreads throughout Germany and later to England and Eastern Lowland Scotland. The video below gives a good history of the Germans. Start from 1:06 if you want to get to the point. Errr, that paganism of scandinavia is not germanic. Sorry to disappoint you, but it were the norway and sweden kings who used to worship God Odin, because, these royal houses were made king by odin himself directly. The other talks about southern german being alpine or northern german etc is what nazi party had said. Slavs were never considered nordic race by them, though, despite being more viking russian types. No, the Aesir was term used by the sweden and norway peopl,e because they were central asians. That aesir became asurs in sanskrit in subcontinent, and they were race of giants, as they were tall. These invaders never had any recorded history of their own, because they were nomads, and their dialects became fully established languages in the regions which they conquered. It pretty much is becoming clear that there was one group from central asia, who established and colonised the portions of norway, sweden, germans, danubians, iceland long time back, and when that got extinct, the native european breeds were also warring against each other.
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Post by jonbain on Apr 15, 2020 18:14:38 GMT
lamburk The entire concept of 'Germany' was a fabrication of the Prussians after they defeated Austria in the 1800's, and then set about trying to assimilate Denmark too. But that failed as the Danes never wanted to be part of any Reich. Languages before the 1800's were never as distinctly separate as they are today, with a spectrum of dialects stretching across all nations. Even today, people on the borders between nations speak a mixture of both in most old-world situations. So the decision to be or not to be 'German' is not at all cast in stone, but purely a construct. Those who perpetuate the sheer myth of Scandinavians being Germanic are really just suckers for Nazi propaganda. That border between Denmark, and the Saxons is older and more rigid than just about any border in the world. Even if the borders of the Saxons themselves have shifted radically so much over the centuries that you can find the world 'Saxon' wandering around all over the maps over the ages.Still, that border between Europe and Scandinavia runs like a roman wall through the bottom of the Jutland peninsula. Culturally they are as separate as any two cultures can be. And such decisions to be or not be part of another's empire is always based on transcendent ethics. Now I have finally understood the reason for the conversion of the anglo saxons, and finally the scandinavians, as they were warring tribes against each other. The point about the border being very rigid is this - both of these tribes tried to proclaimed their descendancy from the odin, they both have similar mythos. however, the talk here clearly has shown that the OLD CENTRAL ASIAN RULING CLASSES did not breed with any girls. they rather united these regions into their kingdoms, and when their rule got finished, the aristocrats or elite groups, under the CENTRAL ASIAN KINGDOMS, tried to establish their hegemony, and warred against each other. So all talk of genetics, DNA,bloodlines are non sensical. Another myth about the Norse religion is that it is pre-Christian. The earliest vague traces of Odin and Thor are only from the 8th century. The Saxons that populated England and had the border with Denmark actually predate the Nordic religion too. The Norse tradition was only written down for the first time after the clashes with the English, and the population of Iceland. And there is a world of difference between waving a flag with a cross on it, and being able to read or understand the religion itself anyways. Ethics will always be the division between peoples, regardless of narrative. The underlying principle in ethics is always fraternity versus domination, and that is exemplified by open respect between genders. So its always a case of chivalry versus chauvinism.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2020 18:23:15 GMT
Now I have finally understood the reason for the conversion of the anglo saxons, and finally the scandinavians, as they were warring tribes against each other. The point about the border being very rigid is this - both of these tribes tried to proclaimed their descendancy from the odin, they both have similar mythos. however, the talk here clearly has shown that the OLD CENTRAL ASIAN RULING CLASSES did not breed with any girls. they rather united these regions into their kingdoms, and when their rule got finished, the aristocrats or elite groups, under the CENTRAL ASIAN KINGDOMS, tried to establish their hegemony, and warred against each other. So all talk of genetics, DNA,bloodlines are non sensical. Another myth about the Norse religion is that it is pre-Christian. The earliest vague traces of Odin and Thor are only from the 8th century. The Saxons that populated England and had the border with Denmark actually predate the Nordic religion too. The Norse tradition was only written down for the first time after the clashes with the English, and the population of Iceland.And there is a world of difference between waving a flag with a cross on it, and being able to read or understand the religion itself anyways. Ethics will always be the division between peoples, regardless of narrative. The underlying principle in ethics is always fraternity versus domination, and that is exemplified by open respect between genders. So its always a case of chivalry versus chauvinism. You have answered all questions. Those thor,odin were mentioned as gods by Icelandic poet anyways. Neither the saxons nor danish people have been same, they were part of one kingdoms long time back. German were colonized by Romans also I guess Germans try too hard to proclaim themselves as master race
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Clovis Merovingian
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Apr 16, 2020 7:59:58 GMT
Germans have cultural (and some genetic) roots from Scandinavia. The Germanic tribes originated in Scandinavia and spread south into Germany conquering and assimilating the native Celtic tribes there. There ARE alot of Nordic Germans in the northernmost part of Germany where the Scandinavian Germanics wiped out the tribes living there. In Southern Germany the people there have more of an alpine look because these places were settled after the Roman empire moved out and the Germanic tribes assimilated and interbred with these people rather than exterminating them. There is also a huge Slavic influence from the east. The part about Asia minor people being the Aesir was Snorri Sturluson trying to give the gods in the Prose Edda a nobler origin than being demons which the Christians of the time believed they were so it would be palatable to a Christian audience. The only real difference between the Vikings and other Germanic people in the later parts of the Dark Ages were that the other Germanics were close in proximity to the Celtic and Latin peoples of western Europe and were Christianized far earlier and developed state apparatuses far earlier (the Germans were forced out of a tribal existence after being conquered by Charlemagne's empire and being turned into feudal serfs by him). Scandinavia was in the Northern periphery of Europe so still retained Germanic paganism and the worship of Thor, Odin, Frey, Tyr and the rest. This spread of Germanic culture and genes can be seen from this map. As you can see the core of Germanic Y DNA is in Scandinavia and spreads throughout Germany and later to England and Eastern Lowland Scotland. The video below gives a good history of the Germans. Start from 1:06 if you want to get to the point. Errr, that paganism of scandinavia is not germanic. Sorry to disappoint you, but it were the norway and sweden kings who used to worship God Odin, because, these royal houses were made king by odin himself directly. The other talks about southern german being alpine or northern german etc is what nazi party had said. Slavs were never considered nordic race by them, though, despite being more viking russian types. No, the Aesir was term used by the sweden and norway peopl,e because they were central asians. That aesir became asurs in sanskrit in subcontinent, and they were race of giants, as they were tall. These invaders never had any recorded history of their own, because they were nomads, and their dialects became fully established languages in the regions which they conquered. It pretty much is becoming clear that there was one group from central asia, who established and colonised the portions of norway, sweden, germans, danubians, iceland long time back, and when that got extinct, the native european breeds were also warring against each other. Yes, the paganism of Scandinavia is Germanic because the Scandinavians are Germanic and in fact the genesis point of Germanic culture. If your theory about Scandinavian gods being kings from central Asia are true than this would've happened 5,000 years before Snorri Sturluson's Poetic Edda more or less. This would be way before the Scandinavians spread into Germany. When the Scandinavians spread into Germany they would've brought their religion with them (and did as the historical record shows). There also seems to be this strange conflation that you and jonbain are making between "Germanic" and German. Germans are a Germanic people but Germanic people are not necessarily German. The Germans do not call themselves Germans in their native language. They call themselves the Deutsch and their country Deutschland. Germanic is a similar term to "Celtic" or "Slavic", it refers to a broad ethnolinguistic and cultural grouping. The Irish, Highland Scots, Welsh, Cornish, Manx, and Breton are Celtic because they have a related language, culture, history, and deities. The term Germanic similarly refers to such a related ethnic grouping. The Germanic peoples speak a Germanic language, descend from Germanic tribes, and worshipped basically the same Germanic gods. These people include the Swedes, Danes, Norwegians, Germans, Swiss Germans, Austrians, Luxembergers, English, Lowland Scots, Dutch, Flemish, Farose, Icelanders, Frisians, Afrikaners, and these peoples' diaspora across the world. The term Aesir is related to the term Asura because the terms have their origins in related concepts in Indo European mythology. The Anglo Saxons in who's Scandinavian cultural origins are being denied by jonbain also worshipped the Aesir. They called them the Ese. They also worshipped the Vanir gods as well calling them the Wen. The giants that the gods fought were called Ettins. Their hero god of thunder Thunor (Thor) liked slaying Ettins with his hammer. They belied in elves and dwarves and a world tree called Irminsul (Yggdrasil) that connected the seven worlds (in compared to the Norsemen's nine) mentioned in the nine herbs charm. simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_mythologySaying that "Saxon culture" was significantly different than Scandinavian culture in the Viking age is really bizzare from a historical standpoint.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 8:35:46 GMT
Errr, that paganism of scandinavia is not germanic. Sorry to disappoint you, but it were the norway and sweden kings who used to worship God Odin, because, these royal houses were made king by odin himself directly. The other talks about southern german being alpine or northern german etc is what nazi party had said. Slavs were never considered nordic race by them, though, despite being more viking russian types. No, the Aesir was term used by the sweden and norway peopl,e because they were central asians. That aesir became asurs in sanskrit in subcontinent, and they were race of giants, as they were tall. These invaders never had any recorded history of their own, because they were nomads, and their dialects became fully established languages in the regions which they conquered. It pretty much is becoming clear that there was one group from central asia, who established and colonised the portions of norway, sweden, germans, danubians, iceland long time back, and when that got extinct, the native european breeds were also warring against each other. Yes, the paganism of Scandinavia is Germanic because the Scandinavians are Germanic and in fact the genesis point of Germanic culture. If your theory about Scandinavian gods being kings from central Asia are true than this would've happened 5,000 years before Snorri Sturluson's Poetic Edda more or less. This would be way before the Scandinavians spread into Germany. When the Scandinavians spread into Germany they would've brought their religion with them (and did as the historical record shows). There also seems to be this strange conflation that you and jonbain are making between "Germanic" and German. Germans are a Germanic people but Germanic people are not necessarily German. The Germans do not call themselves Germans in their native language. They call themselves the Deutsch and their country Deutschland. Germanic is a similar term to "Celtic" or "Slavic", it refers to a broad ethnolinguistic and cultural grouping. The term Aesir is related to the term Asura because the terms have their origins in related concepts in Indo European mythology. The Anglo Saxons in who's Scandinavian cultural origins are being denied by jonbain also worshipped the Aesir. They called them the Ese. They also worshipped the Vanir gods as well calling them the Wen. The giants that the gods fought were called Ettins. Their hero god of thunder Thunor (Thor) liked slaying Ettins with his hammer. They belied in elves and dwarves and a world tree called Irminsul (Yggdrasil) that connected the seven worlds (in compared to the Norsemen's nine) mentioned in the nine herbs charm. simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_mythologySaying that "Saxon culture" was significantly different than Scandinavian culture in the Viking age is really bizzare from a historical standpoint. Exactly, what I have found out, that there was a ruling class of IndoEuropeans language bearers who had conquered those regions, which are now known as germany, denmark, norway, sweden, and it happened 5000 years back, because, this particualr culture of indo europeans was prominent at that time. Now, I am not denying about the things, that germans called themselves as deutchse people, infact that's the correct name of germany, deutscheland. What I know is that Anglo Saxon paganism worshipped odin as the royal god and same was done by the kings of norway, sweden etc. There could be a point that these royal houses or dynasties were connected, and were living as administrators in these regions.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 8:47:21 GMT
//The Irish, Highland Scots, Welsh, Cornish, Manx, and Breton are Celtic because they have a related language, culture, history, and deities. The term Germanic similarly refers to such a related ethnic grouping. The Germanic peoples speak a Germanic language, descend from Germanic tribes, and worshipped basically the same Germanic gods. These people include the Swedes, Danes, Norwegians, Germans, Swiss Germans, Austrians, Luxembergers, English, Lowland Scots, Dutch, Flemish, Farose, Icelanders, Frisians, Afrikaners, and these peoples' diaspora across the worl//
I am not denying about the europeans not being europeans, as I don't believein the crap what's written in the media, that europeans are migrants and all, and blue eyes blonde hairs came from some african and bullcrap.
It's clear, that europeans ruling classes were always present, with the same blue eyes blond hairs, a paritcular people, whom they worshipped during pre chrisitniasation did come, brought the languages as their dialects, when their rule got over, the european ruling classes again warred against each other.
In 8th century, after arabs conquest, these ruling classes were turned into gods, so as to fight the foreigners. So all those mythlogies of thor and odin.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 16:36:05 GMT
//This would be way before the Scandinavians spread into Germany//this is highly unlikely to happen, because there are ample evidences of pagan german and pagan norway/sweden/danes warring against each other. The post is about how norse became christian, all of a sudden from being a pagan society. And all the royal houses of the norway king used to pay homage to the same god odin, whom even anglo saxon used to worship. It were the anglo saxons who converted to christianity, and there were series of battles with the norwegian kings, so the french speaking vikings or normans, finally became christian. This clearly shows that scandinavian, germans are a different people, in all terms, cutlurally, racially, ethnically, otherwise, why the war has to happen, despite worshipping the same god? Even if that's the case, why do a person of german origin needs a visa to move to norway or vice versa? The borders do exist, not just physical, but at moral level also. Because, the person whom these royal house were worshipping as god, actually was a person who ruled on them. He did not have to go there physically, but took it under there jurisdiction, in such manner, that every one thinks, he made a visit to those nation. And as jonbain has already stated, this nordic paganism was an 8th century thing, which is true also, because thor did not have blue eyes blond haired, as he was from asia minor, which means, even the poetic eddas were mythologies and they spoke about a dynasty, who did not have to pay a visit to north anyways, but can control by their army, long time back, and the pagan norwegeian kings were using those works, and even after their conversion, they were extending, not before socialism took there. BTW, did I forget to mention, that eddas also talks about the arrival of third anti christ, yes, norway or nordic countries, whom hitler was pitching as master race, talks about third anti christ, and it's from central asia mythos.
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