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Post by AmericanCharm on May 29, 2018 5:40:48 GMT
What do you guys think? I personally have mixed opinions. On one hand I think it’s a repulsive and repugnant lifestyle and I believe if legalized many men would be more likely to seek this kind of companionship. Especially if we went the direction Australia did with brothels. If this was the case though and the girls were being constantly tested like do over there, then perhaps it’s an idea that could work. At least it seems a better option than men seeking out street walkers, leading to the spreading of STDs.
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Post by DKTrav88 on May 31, 2018 23:53:26 GMT
Regardless of laws, people will always have freedom of choice. Laws with punishments help to prevent people from breaking those laws as they will have to face repercussion for doing wrong and it protects them and others from harm. This is why I brought up murder, because once you legalize murder, there’s nothing wrong with it, no punishment, no repercussion, people would be killing each other everywhere. So take it to an extreme, legalize everything, imagine the chaos. We’d have a Mad Max/Fallout kind of world. So in conclusion I do not agree with legalizing prostitution because the legalizing of it tells people there is nothing wrong with being sexually immoral and soliciting for sex and thinking of sex as a commodity as there is no repercussion for participating in it, and legalization doesn’t protect us from harm. Evil people are allowed to be evil, because we have free will. Laws do not at all take away our free will. Laws keep the order of things, they promote morality, and they help protect us from evil; without laws to protect us we have chaos and disorder, and evil runs amuck doing as it wills with no hinderance. This may not always be true, but it is when you a proper moral foundation by which laws are set and enforced. The increase in laws causes an increase in the breaking of laws akin to a "forbidden fruit effect". With the issue of marijuana drug trades existed outside the system that caused a wave of crime and violence. With the legalization of marijuanna regulations stay in place which cut down any violence in regards to the drug trade itself, while maintaining government control and sanctions.
Prostitution I am against. However the truth is people will sleep around and this causes an inherent problem within the family structure and society. Legalizing prostitution while enforcing stricter adultery laws will prevent certain degrees of dissolution in the family structure. We already live in mad/max fallout kind of world, the only difference is that we still have electricity...that is it...and prostitution is still illegal.
Now will the legalization of prostitution and enforcement of strict marriage laws cause an instantaneous change? No, the culture is already driven over the cliff and to be quite frank it is time for it to be pushed over to die. There is no moral law any more...period.
Yea, so what though? Like I asked, what is your goal? Is it to stop lawlessness by making immoral things legal to do and hence less laws are broken? Okay, we aren't talking about marijuana, we are talking about prostitution. I'd like to stick to the topic if we can please. So, just because people will do something immoral means we should let them? Again, why not apply this to murder or rape or theft? Immorality is immorality no matter how you look at it. Why not enforce strict prostitution laws on top of strict adultery laws? That way we can deter sex as a commodity and adultery at the same time. It isn't only married people who go for out of their way to pay for sex. Yes, people will have sex regardless of any law against prostitution, but why enable sex as a commodity? I'm not understanding the moral justification behind legalizing prostitution at all. And no, we don't live in a Mad Max kind of world not even close.. it would be pure anarchy if we were, which it isn't at all. It seems like you keep going back to marriage for some reason and I'm not understanding why. It's like you're trying to pull a red herring on me. Can we please stick to the legalization of prostitution? That's the topic. So the laws against murder aren't moral? And theft? And rape? And all the rest that protect innocent people? To be honest, you sound a bit despairing.
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 1, 2018 0:38:09 GMT
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Clovis Merovingian
Prestige/VIP
Elder
Posts: 2,697
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Meta-Ethnicity: Anglo-American
Ethnicity: Deep Southerner
Country: My State and my Region are my country
Region: The Deep South
Location: South Carolina
Ancestry: Gaelic (patrilineal), English, Ulster Scots/Scots Irish, Scottish, German, Swiss German, Swedish, Manx, Finnish, Norman French/Quebecois (distantly), Dutch (distantly)
Taxonomy: Borreby/Alpine/ Nordid mix
Y-DNA: R-S660/R-DF109
mtDNA: T1a1
Politics: Conservative
Religion: Christian
Hero: Andrew Jackson, Thomas Jefferson, James K. Polk
Age: 30
Philosophy: I try to find out what is true as best I can.
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Jun 1, 2018 2:38:11 GMT
And what about preserving the chastity of men? Do you not think that's also important. What you'd have in a society that legalizes prostitution is the same as what we have now with legalized porn. It would be a society where most men can and will partake in this vice (because you've made it so easy) leaving those chaste women to marry unchaste men. Its hardly fair to the women. True morality does not tolerate fornication (sex before marriage) in either of the sexes. It is evil regardless of the gender. The chastity of men doesn't matter. This can be seen from biology, from history, and from sociology. Men and women have different responsibilities. Men fight wars and provide for the family. Women must guard their chastity and care for the family. The sexes are fundamentally different. In Christianity, my religion, it is a sin for a man or a woman equally to have sex outside the confines of marriage. A man's chastity is as important as a females. Just because the sexes are different does not mean that morality does not apply equally. You talk of morality and wanting a moral society but a society where chaste women are forced to marry a pack of man Ok,,, just let me cry,,,leave me alones does not sound like a moral society to me. In fact a society where male Ok,,, just let me cry,,,leave me alones are tolerated does not sound like a moral society to me.
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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 1, 2018 6:11:12 GMT
I meant to say, “it isn’t only married people who go out of their way to pay for sex” And not that all of them do, but some do unfortunately :( its bad enough that people treat sex like a commodity. It’s supposed to be for marriage only.
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Post by fschmidt on Jun 1, 2018 7:07:30 GMT
In Christianity, my religion, it is a sin for a man or a woman equally to have sex outside the confines of marriage. A man's chastity is as important as a females. Just because the sexes are different does not mean that morality does not apply equally. You talk of morality and wanting a moral society but a society where chaste women are forced to marry a pack of man Ok,,, just let me cry,,,leave me alones does not sound like a moral society to me. In fact a society where male Ok,,, just let me cry,,,leave me alones are tolerated does not sound like a moral society to me. This is one of many reasons that I am not a Christian. But let me ask you, did I sin by letting my wife do all the breast feeding of our children while I did none? Was I guilty sexism here? When exactly should the same rules apply to the sexes and when not? And how do you define morality?
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Clovis Merovingian
Prestige/VIP
Elder
Posts: 2,697
Likes: 1,757
Meta-Ethnicity: Anglo-American
Ethnicity: Deep Southerner
Country: My State and my Region are my country
Region: The Deep South
Location: South Carolina
Ancestry: Gaelic (patrilineal), English, Ulster Scots/Scots Irish, Scottish, German, Swiss German, Swedish, Manx, Finnish, Norman French/Quebecois (distantly), Dutch (distantly)
Taxonomy: Borreby/Alpine/ Nordid mix
Y-DNA: R-S660/R-DF109
mtDNA: T1a1
Politics: Conservative
Religion: Christian
Hero: Andrew Jackson, Thomas Jefferson, James K. Polk
Age: 30
Philosophy: I try to find out what is true as best I can.
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Jun 1, 2018 8:02:57 GMT
In Christianity, my religion, it is a sin for a man or a woman equally to have sex outside the confines of marriage. A man's chastity is as important as a females. Just because the sexes are different does not mean that morality does not apply equally. You talk of morality and wanting a moral society but a society where chaste women are forced to marry a pack of man Ok,,, just let me cry,,,leave me alones does not sound like a moral society to me. In fact a society where male Ok,,, just let me cry,,,leave me alones are tolerated does not sound like a moral society to me. This is one of many reasons that I am not a Christian. But let me ask you, did I sin by letting my wife do all the breast feeding of our children while I did none? Was I guilty sexism here? When exactly should the same rules apply to the sexes and when not? And how do you define morality? WTF are you on about? Breast feeding isn't a sin. If you put your babies mouth to your nipple it wouldn't be a sin... I'd be weird, and counter productive, and you probably shouldn't do it or you'll look like a nutter, but its not a sin. I define morality by what God says is right and wrong and I believe that a sin is a sin regardless of the gender. This isn't an argument about sexism, this is an argument that fornication is wrong regardless of who's doing it. Sin applies to all peoples equally. Also I am not a Muslim because Islam is a degenerate religion founded by a genocidal pedophilic rapist with barbaric followers who commit horrific atrocities in accordance with that same retard's preachings so they can go to heaven and have an orgy with 72 virgins because no one wants to willingly sleep with them in this earthy life. That's real moral and soooooo much less degenerate than our "degenerate modern western society" .
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Post by fschmidt on Jun 1, 2018 8:13:56 GMT
WTF are you on about? Breast feeding isn't a sin. If you put your babies mouth to your nipple it wouldn't be a sin... I'd be weird, and counter productive, and you probably shouldn't do it or you'll look like a nutter, but its not a sin. I define morality by what God says is right and wrong and I believe that a sin is a sin regardless of the gender. This isn't an argument about sexism, this is an argument that fornication is wrong regardless of who's doing it. Sin applies to all peoples equally. Also I am not a Muslim because Islam is a degenerate religion founded by a genocidal pedophilic rapist with barbaric followers who commit horrific atrocities in accordance with that same retard's preachings so they can go to heaven and have an orgy with 72 virgins because no one wants to willingly sleep with them in this earthy life. That's real moral and soooooo much less degenerate than our "degenerate modern western society" . Obviously I was trying to make an absurd analogy in order to show that the same rules don't always apply to men and women. Since your definition of morality is circular, I can't possibly argue against it. You are saying that morality is defined by Christianity, therefore Christian rules are moral. There is no possible argument against such circular reasoning. My view just isn't in that circle.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2018 14:24:20 GMT
The increase in laws causes an increase in the breaking of laws akin to a "forbidden fruit effect". With the issue of marijuana drug trades existed outside the system that caused a wave of crime and violence. With the legalization of marijuanna regulations stay in place which cut down any violence in regards to the drug trade itself, while maintaining government control and sanctions.
Prostitution I am against. However the truth is people will sleep around and this causes an inherent problem within the family structure and society. Legalizing prostitution while enforcing stricter adultery laws will prevent certain degrees of dissolution in the family structure. We already live in mad/max fallout kind of world, the only difference is that we still have electricity...that is it...and prostitution is still illegal.
Now will the legalization of prostitution and enforcement of strict marriage laws cause an instantaneous change? No, the culture is already driven over the cliff and to be quite frank it is time for it to be pushed over to die. There is no moral law any more...period.
Yea, so what though? Like I asked, what is your goal? Is it to stop lawlessness by making immoral things legal to do and hence less laws are broken? Okay, we aren't talking about marijuana, we are talking about prostitution. I'd like to stick to the topic if we can please. Lawlessness inevitably happens, the only means to deal with it is to directed it away from certain institutions by allowing it to consume itself. Just because something is made "illegal" does not mean it stops...it means there is no control over it as no law can regulate it. This sound like a strange statement so I will elaborate on it. Prostitution is illegal, yet it still happens, because of the spread of it the fact it is illegal only means the criminal justice system has to extend its reach to control it further and hence become depleted. This depletion cuts short there ability to deal with further crimes or prevents them with dealing with prostitution all together. So while prostitution may be illegal...nothing really happens to it. The issue of crime is less of making something "good" or "evil" but rather controlling it.So, just because people will do something immoral means we should let them? Again, why not apply this to murder or rape or theft? Immorality is immorality no matter how you look at it. Why not enforce strict prostitution laws on top of strict adultery laws? That way we can deter sex as a commodity and adultery at the same time. It isn't only married people who go for out of their way to pay for sex. Yes, people will have sex regardless of any law against prostitution, but why enable sex as a commodity? I'm not understanding the moral justification behind legalizing prostitution at all. And no, we don't live in a Mad Max kind of world not even close.. it would be pure anarchy if we were, which it isn't at all. It is pure anarchy already, the only reason no one is killing each other is because the electricity and television are still on...moral law died in the U.S. along time ago. Last job I worked, one man had a broken arm and had to keep working otherwise he would lose his job. Another suffered from crippling arthritis while in his mid thirties. You have people with slipped disks in their twenties who don't know in 15+ years they will have to be put on disability unless they can heal. Young men in their twenties trying to support families only to have to come home to their wives on facebook relishing in the "likes" of other men from photos of themselves they put up. Men and women who spent their free time getting high in order to deal with the fact they have no futures...why? No moral order. No meaning. Just continual distraction and no real peace or satisfaction. Ideas are the means through which a people and culture operate, but when a culture gives up the ability to think (and hence "believe" in anything of value) the seeds of its destruction are already sown. You think their is no anarchy, but the truth is the only thing holding mad max back is the fact the television is still on to provide the carthasis people require to get through the day.It seems like you keep going back to marriage for some reason and I'm not understanding why. It's like you're trying to pull a red herring on me. Can we please stick to the legalization of prostitution? That's the topic. The legalization of prostitution is meant to direct away the "immoral" from the institution of marriage altogether so that civilization can continue. When sex is destroyed society produced nothing of any material, intellectual or artistic value. The legalization of prostitution is merely a means to encapsulate the chaotic element of the human condition and directed it away from what is ordered and good. So the laws against murder aren't moral? And theft? And rape? And all the rest that protect innocent people? To be honest, you sound a bit despairing. The laws do not work because they are not enforced. Criminals are cycled out of the system and just go back to "do what they do". Just had a neighbor robbed about 2 weeks ago. Do you know how many times the robbers where in jail, each? 5-6 times already. Have another neighbor, who may potentially be poaching my property, who was in jail for killing a man with a screw driver and old woman years ago. The question that comes to mine...and pardon the vulgarity..."Will I ever have to deal with this mother fucker?" If I have to and kill him, I go to jail. On the other hand if he is poaching my property, big emphasis on "if", that cannot be allowed either for a variety of reason. The thing of it is...I don't even live in the city. Now will I ever had to deal with the previously mentioned "extremes"? Probably not and frankly it is the least of my worries and more of a basic example...but when I society has to live questioning not just the motive of their neighbors and even those of immediate family, this distrust causes an element of seperation which only increases over time. Without moral order, without crime being "controlled", boundaries are not able to be kept or maintained.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2018 14:26:16 GMT
This is one of many reasons that I am not a Christian. But let me ask you, did I sin by letting my wife do all the breast feeding of our children while I did none? Was I guilty sexism here? When exactly should the same rules apply to the sexes and when not? And how do you define morality? WTF are you on about? Breast feeding isn't a sin. If you put your babies mouth to your nipple it wouldn't be a sin... I'd be weird, and counter productive, and you probably shouldn't do it or you'll look like a nutter, but its not a sin. I define morality by what God says is right and wrong and I believe that a sin is a sin regardless of the gender. This isn't an argument about sexism, this is an argument that fornication is wrong regardless of who's doing it. Sin applies to all peoples equally. Also I am not a Muslim because Islam is a degenerate religion founded by a genocidal pedophilic rapist with barbaric followers who commit horrific atrocities in accordance with that same retard's preachings so they can go to heaven and have an orgy with 72 virgins because no one wants to willingly sleep with them in this earthy life. That's real moral and soooooo much less degenerate than our "degenerate modern western society" . The last thing we need is more division between peoples of various faiths. One only has to go to work, go home, turn on the television to see that the division between our brothers and sisters is great enough already. The question, in regards to the faiths, is less of where we differ but what we have in common.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Jun 1, 2018 22:08:12 GMT
To be honest, if you look at modern Europe (part of the West) there is more Islam there than Christianity...in any case, Islam is gaining ground!
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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 2, 2018 2:42:23 GMT
Yea, so what though? Like I asked, what is your goal? Is it to stop lawlessness by making immoral things legal to do and hence less laws are broken? Okay, we aren't talking about marijuana, we are talking about prostitution. I'd like to stick to the topic if we can please. Lawlessness inevitably happens, the only means to deal with it is to directed it away from certain institutions by allowing it to consume itself. Just because something is made "illegal" does not mean it stops...it means there is no control over it as no law can regulate it. This sound like a strange statement so I will elaborate on it. Prostitution is illegal, yet it still happens, because of the spread of it the fact it is illegal only means the criminal justice system has to extend its reach to control it further and hence become depleted. This depletion cuts short there ability to deal with further crimes or prevents them with dealing with prostitution all together. So while prostitution may be illegal...nothing really happens to it. The issue of crime is less of making something "good" or "evil" but rather controlling it.So, just because people will do something immoral means we should let them? Again, why not apply this to murder or rape or theft? Immorality is immorality no matter how you look at it. Why not enforce strict prostitution laws on top of strict adultery laws? That way we can deter sex as a commodity and adultery at the same time. It isn't only married people who go for out of their way to pay for sex. Yes, people will have sex regardless of any law against prostitution, but why enable sex as a commodity? I'm not understanding the moral justification behind legalizing prostitution at all. And no, we don't live in a Mad Max kind of world not even close.. it would be pure anarchy if we were, which it isn't at all. It is pure anarchy already, the only reason no one is killing each other is because the electricity and television are still on...moral law died in the U.S. along time ago. Last job I worked, one man had a broken arm and had to keep working otherwise he would lose his job. Another suffered from crippling arthritis while in his mid thirties. You have people with slipped disks in their twenties who don't know in 15+ years they will have to be put on disability unless they can heal. Young men in their twenties trying to support families only to have to come home to their wives on facebook relishing in the "likes" of other men from photos of themselves they put up. Men and women who spent their free time getting high in order to deal with the fact they have no futures...why? No moral order. No meaning. Just continual distraction and no real peace or satisfaction. Ideas are the means through which a people and culture operate, but when a culture gives up the ability to think (and hence "believe" in anything of value) the seeds of its destruction are already sown. You think their is no anarchy, but the truth is the only thing holding mad max back is the fact the television is still on to provide the carthasis people require to get through the day.It seems like you keep going back to marriage for some reason and I'm not understanding why. It's like you're trying to pull a red herring on me. Can we please stick to the legalization of prostitution? That's the topic. The legalization of prostitution is meant to direct away the "immoral" from the institution of marriage altogether so that civilization can continue. When sex is destroyed society produced nothing of any material, intellectual or artistic value. The legalization of prostitution is merely a means to encapsulate the chaotic element of the human condition and directed it away from what is ordered and good. So the laws against murder aren't moral? And theft? And rape? And all the rest that protect innocent people? To be honest, you sound a bit despairing. The laws do not work because they are not enforced. Criminals are cycled out of the system and just go back to "do what they do". Just had a neighbor robbed about 2 weeks ago. Do you know how many times the robbers where in jail, each? 5-6 times already. Have another neighbor, who may potentially be poaching my property, who was in jail for killing a man with a screw driver and old woman years ago. The question that comes to mine...and pardon the vulgarity..."Will I ever have to deal with this mother fucker?" If I have to and kill him, I go to jail. On the other hand if he is poaching my property, big emphasis on "if", that cannot be allowed either for a variety of reason. The thing of it is...I don't even live in the city. Now will I ever had to deal with the previously mentioned "extremes"? Probably not and frankly it is the least of my worries and more of a basic example...but when I society has to live questioning not just the motive of their neighbors and even those of immediate family, this distrust causes an element of seperation which only increases over time. Without moral order, without crime being "controlled", boundaries are not able to be kept or maintained. fine lets just let everything go and let everyone do whatever they want. The strongest survives. Sounds great.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2018 9:00:41 GMT
Already spying?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2018 9:01:52 GMT
To be honest, if you look at modern Europe (part of the West) there is more Islam there than Christianity...in any case, Islam is gaining ground! all political WINGS are islamists, even I have recognized this
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 2, 2018 9:03:24 GMT
Already spying? What you mean? I was just confused what he was saying. I have trouble understanding his wording sometimes Shrug
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2018 9:13:13 GMT
It isn't only married people who go for out of their way to pay for sex.
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