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Post by joustos on Nov 5, 2021 14:58:12 GMT
Various threads in this section ["History & Ethogenesis"] -- which are quite interesting to me-- have not been exhausted. So, I re-introduce some topics ["Western Man, Western Civilization"] which have been treated elsewhere and for a long time albeit, for me, without any final resolution: I question some of their views or theories. I will be specific, in case some of you are not already familiar with them. To begin with: To speak of Western/Occidental Man or Civilization is to deal with historical men, not with "Man" in the abstract [as an abstract concept]. Secondly, speaking of Occidental or of Oriental Man is to already classify humans according to a "flat Earth" geography which is antiquated in today's Western civilization -- my point being that any theory or conceptualization or discourse reflects moments of human history or, I dare say, moments of human ecology (the world as humans make it or conceive it, for themelves). Thirdly, speaking of historical men [as they are] is not meant to imply that men should be orought to be as they are known/described to be. // To continue
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Post by joustos on Nov 5, 2021 16:15:17 GMT
Recently I came across an interesting webzine [web magazine], which has been around for some years: "The Occidental Observer", which is about "White Identity, Interests, Culture" and, therefore, has been branded Racist by some anti-WhiteRace racists. I read and examined Chad Crowley's "Faustian Rome", an example of a White culture or civilization -- to which I shall come back in a moment. The concept of a Faustian Culture was put forth by a philosopher of history, Oswald Spengler, in his "Decline of the West". He used the myth of Doctor Faust, a man who wanted unlimited knowledge and power. As depicted by Goethe and others, in order to obtain them, he sold his soul to the devil [but was eventually redeemed by a pure maiden in the second Part of Goethe's drama].Speaking metaphorically, Spengler accounts for the modern decline of the West by its relinguishing or selling of its "soul" [identity or character]. Crowley does the same for Rome or the Roman civilization
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Post by joustos on Nov 5, 2021 17:47:40 GMT
Says Crowley, "The fallof Rome coincides withnits abandonment of its Faustian Indo-European patrimony, as evidenced by its demographic shift, immorality, and overall degeneration of the martial spirit of Indo-Europe ... notably after the 2nd century A.D." (Spengler and his followers draw parallels in history.... America is the next place where the downfall ofthe Occidental Man is becoming evident....)In this process we see the linguistic identification of Occidental, Indo-European, etc. Anyway, their view is that the decline, downfall, or death of a civilization is brought about by the decadent people themselves. [The downfall of an outstanding/noble person is what Aristotle defines Tragedy as.]// Spengler characterized or classified various world civilizations, but I doubt that the martial spirit is typical of the Occidental Man. He also forgot that historically there are regenerations, such as the Renaissance after the Middle/Dark Age which followed the fall of Rome. Anyway, was there really a Faustian ambition that Rome wished to realize?
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Post by joustos on Nov 5, 2021 19:59:05 GMT
The martial spirit. What is it? The spirit or drive to fight, to make war, since Mars has been called the god of war. Well, before going into battle, some Roman soldiers used to strike their shields with their lances in order to awaken Mars and give them courage. (To have the courage to face battle and its dangers is to have the martial spirit. Having the courage or fervor/incitement to battle is a matter of experience.) Many years ago I was in the [U.S.]Army, an artillery man, during the Cuban crisis.On a sunday afternoon my platoon was taken (marched to) a theater in order to be instructed about President Kennedy's emergency plan to assist a friedly country[such as the future Vietnam] that asks for assistance: The U.S.Military will take control of "every field of endeavor" in that country -- economic, educational, military, publications, etc. [Later on,I wrote a letter to him to point out that this amounted to impose "martial law" on the friedly country, and that, should an emergency arise in the U.S., the president might order the military to take over every field of human endeavor. I was horrified and got in trouble for this.] My point: While marching in that warm, lazy, afternoon, I suddenly felt a strange impulse to go forward and accomplish something great. It was like a voice, but it did no specify what had to be done. The impulse persisted for a while and I thought that if I were in ancient times, I would have thought that Mars was prodding/inciting me to accomplish something. It faded as I sat in the theater and listened to the mission we soldiers were being prepared for or what now I would call a dishonorable mission, not inspired by Mars. Many other soldiers fell asleep.
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Post by thesageofmainstreet on Nov 5, 2021 20:29:03 GMT
Various threads in this section ["History & Ethogenesis"] -- which are quite interesting to me-- have not been exhausted. So, I re-introduce some topics ["Western Man, Western Civilization"] which have been treated elsewhere and for a long time albeit, for me, without any final resolution: I question some of their views or theories. I will be specific, in case some of you are not already familiar with them. To begin with: To speak of Western/Occidental Man or Civilization is to deal with historical men, not with "Man" in the abstract [as an abstract concept]. Secondly, speaking of Occidental or of Oriental Man is to already classify humans according to a "flat Earth" geography which is antiquated in today's Western civilization -- my point being that any theory or conceptualization or discourse reflects moments of human history or, I dare say, moments of human ecology (the world as humans make it or conceive it, for themelves). Thirdly, speaking of historical men [as they are] is not meant to imply that men should be orought to be as they are known/described to be. // To continue
Whites Who Are Born Rich Hate and Fear All Other White PeopleHereditary wealth, business, political power, and cultural manipulation cause the carefully hidden cancer that has destroyed all civilizations. In the formerly United States, unearned and carcinogenic birth privileges reached their final stage of societal destruction during the Vietnam War, when how much money a young man's Daddy had determined whether he would live sheltered and safe or die in a jungle. All the juniorcrat rulers' bought and paid for historians intentionally ignore this key to understanding decline and fall. There is no reason to read these traitors, except to spy on them. The wannabe Preppies who ran away to college, which is an "heiristocratic" institution for non-entitled teenagers who are afraid to grow up, are insignificant followers. So the masses, by design, have no influence on decline. Not even their cowardice, slavishness, and stupidity are their own fault, but created by the pervasive control of Birth-Class Supremacy.
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Post by joustos on Nov 5, 2021 21:10:55 GMT
Final remarks about the proposed subject: To the extent that we can talk about the Western/Occidental/White/Indo-European Man (namely the men who produced their own cultures, or the Western civilization, I would say that {1} he possesses the Martial Spirit (namely the impulse to accomplish something great --to fulfill his needs etc. -- hence to create, to invent, to perfect, to discover; {2} he strives for excellence, which procures happiness for him, whether he is the architect Vitruvius or a shoemaker: an artefact has to e made so as to fit its intended function, has to be durable, and has to be beautiful; {3} He is courageous rather than cowardly, thus striving to overcome or dissipate obstacles or oppositions, regardless of sacrifices to himself, thus securing for himself the freedom of action that is required -- yes, Eugene, Freedom is one of the greatest things Occidental Man wants; {4} in his actions/deeds, he strives to be honorable, just, and loving, wherefore he sees these virtues as his duties [see Cicero], and to judge others in the proper manner (exemplified by Roman jurisprudence); {5} he is resilient, hence regenerative of his culture and innovative (not enslaved by his traditions orinheritance).
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Clovis Merovingian
Prestige/VIP
Elder
Posts: 2,694
Likes: 1,757
Meta-Ethnicity: Anglo-American
Ethnicity: Deep Southerner
Country: My State and my Region are my country
Region: The Deep South
Location: South Carolina
Ancestry: Gaelic (patrilineal), English, Ulster Scots/Scots Irish, Scottish, German, Swiss German, Swedish, Manx, Finnish, Norman French/Quebecois (distantly), Dutch (distantly)
Taxonomy: Borreby/Alpine/ Nordid mix
Y-DNA: R-S660/R-DF109
mtDNA: T1a1
Politics: Conservative
Religion: Christian
Hero: Andrew Jackson, Thomas Jefferson, James K. Polk
Age: 30
Philosophy: I try to find out what is true as best I can.
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Nov 6, 2021 4:34:35 GMT
I will only say this. I hate the term "Western Civilization". It obscures what we're talking about which is the civilization created by Europeans and their diaspora. It is European Civilization, not Western Civilization. It is the most advanced, most moral, most intellectual, greatest in war, science, philosophy, religion, architecture, exploration, literature, music, art, and any other manner of thing that you can name and it was created by Europeans. We shouldn't obscure this fact with a quite frankly strange term like "Western Civilization" to avoid hurting other peoples' feelings. It's European Civilization and it is so successful because European culture is superior to all others.
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Post by joustos on Nov 6, 2021 15:47:33 GMT
I will only say this. I hate the term "Western Civilization". It obscures what we're talking about which is the civilization created by Europeans and their diaspora. It is European Civilization, not Western Civilization. It is the most advanced, most moral, most intellectual, greatest in war, science, philosophy, religion, architecture, exploration, literature, music, art, and any other manner of thing that you can name and it was created by Europeans. We shouldn't obscure this fact with a quite frankly strange term like "Western Civilization" to avoid hurting other peoples' feelings. It's European Civilization and it is so successful because European culture is superior to all others. I agree with you. It is the [aboriginal] Europeans &... that created a --what should we call it?-- a "civilization" , a distinctive material and intellectual culture, wherefore, if at all, we should speak of "European civilization and, abroad, of "Eurocentric" endeavors, education, etc. However, I think that the term "Occidental/Western" has not been used in the strict geographical sense, but to encompass Europe and other parts of the world which are inhabited by Europeans of their descendants. A new terminology is certainly desirable. Anyway, any civilization is not homogenious: any given society has its makers [to designate which I don't have a single word] and its de facto deconstructioners [in the West, the faustian men, who sell their soul for the sake of acquiring political power, wealth, or even fame.
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Post by joustos on Nov 6, 2021 16:18:30 GMT
Various threads in this section ["History & Ethogenesis"] -- which are quite interesting to me-- have not been exhausted. So, I re-introduce some topics ["Western Man, Western Civilization"] which have been treated elsewhere and for a long time albeit, for me, without any final resolution: I question some of their views or theories. I will be specific, in case some of you are not already familiar with them. To begin with: To speak of Western/Occidental Man or Civilization is to deal with historical men, not with "Man" in the abstract [as an abstract concept]. Secondly, speaking of Occidental or of Oriental Man is to already classify humans according to a "flat Earth" geography which is antiquated in today's Western civilization -- my point being that any theory or conceptualization or discourse reflects moments of human history or, I dare say, moments of human ecology (the world as humans make it or conceive it, for themelves). Thirdly, speaking of historical men [as they are] is not meant to imply that men should be orought to be as they are known/described to be. // To continue
Whites Who Are Born Rich Hate and Fear All Other White PeopleHereditary wealth, business, political power, and cultural manipulation cause the carefully hidden cancer that has destroyed all civilizations. In the formerly United States, unearned and carcinogenic birth privileges reached their final stage of societal destruction during the Vietnam War, when how much money a young man's Daddy had determined whether he would live sheltered and safe or die in a jungle. All the juniorcrat rulers' bought and paid for historians intentionally ignore this key to understanding decline and fall. There is no reason to read these traitors, except to spy on them. The wannabe Preppies who ran away to college, which is an "heiristocratic" institution for non-entitled teenagers who are afraid to grow up, are insignificant followers. So the masses, by design, have no influence on decline. Not even their cowardice, slavishness, and stupidity are their own fault, but created by the pervasive control of Birth-Class Supremacy. As you know, thus far I did not deal at all with the decline or the demise of civilizations, whereas you just did, and I admit that hereditary wealth, etc., can be causes of hate and destabilizations. "Cultural manipulation" is a good theme to be developed, for I am already thinking of White Globalists who are indirectly assassinating Western cultures. Meanwhile we must realize that worldwide Whites have no social utopian solidarity or fraternity (whereby to preserve their own lives, dignity, and culture).
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Post by joustos on Nov 6, 2021 17:28:00 GMT
Final remarks about the proposed subject: To the extent that we can talk about the Western/Occidental/White/Indo-European Man (namely the men who produced their own cultures, or the Western civilization, I would say that {1} he possesses the Martial Spirit (namely the impulse to accomplish something great --to fulfill his needs etc. -- hence to create, to invent, to perfect, to discover; {2} he strives for excellence, which procures happiness for him, whether he be the architect Vitruvius or a shoemaker: an artefact has to e made so as to fit its intended function, has to be durable, and has to be beautiful; {3} He is courageous rather than cowardly, thus striving to overcome or dissipate obstacles or oppositions, regardless of sacrifices to himself, thus securing for himself the freedom of action that is required -- yes, Eugene, Freedom is one of the greatest things Occidental Man wants; {4} in his actions/deeds, he strives to be honorable, just, and loving, wherefore he sees these virtues as his duties [see Cicero], and to judge others in the proper manner (exemplified by Roman jurisprudence); {5} he is resilient, hence regenerative of his culture and innovative (not enslaved by his traditions or inheritance). I was about to complete the above discourse, but I responded to two responses. Now then, to continue: {6} he discovers and harnesses natural energies [animal muscle power; fire; flowing rivers; cascading water; wind; light; geothermal energy; and (recently) telluric magnetism (whereby to generate electricity by means of an orbiting rocket and a tethered "satellite"); and {7} he takes adversities in stride, but he has a tragic sense of life, he a lmortal amongst the immortals. // Those are seven qualities, the "magical seven" that belong also to, or proceed from, the (Greek-discovered) seen planets, night luminaries, children of Sky and Earth, replicated in Palestine's Feast of Lights or Seven Days of Generation/Creation: Moon/Selene/Luna, Ares/Mars, Hermes/Mercurius, Zeus/Jupiter, Aphrodite/Venus, Saturn, Sun/Apollo.
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Clovis Merovingian
Prestige/VIP
Elder
Posts: 2,694
Likes: 1,757
Meta-Ethnicity: Anglo-American
Ethnicity: Deep Southerner
Country: My State and my Region are my country
Region: The Deep South
Location: South Carolina
Ancestry: Gaelic (patrilineal), English, Ulster Scots/Scots Irish, Scottish, German, Swiss German, Swedish, Manx, Finnish, Norman French/Quebecois (distantly), Dutch (distantly)
Taxonomy: Borreby/Alpine/ Nordid mix
Y-DNA: R-S660/R-DF109
mtDNA: T1a1
Politics: Conservative
Religion: Christian
Hero: Andrew Jackson, Thomas Jefferson, James K. Polk
Age: 30
Philosophy: I try to find out what is true as best I can.
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Nov 7, 2021 2:21:54 GMT
I will only say this. I hate the term "Western Civilization". It obscures what we're talking about which is the civilization created by Europeans and their diaspora. It is European Civilization, not Western Civilization. It is the most advanced, most moral, most intellectual, greatest in war, science, philosophy, religion, architecture, exploration, literature, music, art, and any other manner of thing that you can name and it was created by Europeans. We shouldn't obscure this fact with a quite frankly strange term like "Western Civilization" to avoid hurting other peoples' feelings. It's European Civilization and it is so successful because European culture is superior to all others. I agree with you. It is the [aboriginal] Europeans &... that created a --what should we call it?-- a "civilization" , a distinctive material and intellectual culture, wherefore, if at all, we should speak of "European civilization and, abroad, of "Eurocentric" endeavors, education, etc. However, I think that the term "Occidental/Western" has not been used in the strict geographical sense, but to encompass Europe and other parts of the world which are inhabited by Europeans of their descendants. A new terminology is certainly desirable. Anyway, any civilization is not homogenious: any given society has its makers [to designate which I don't have a single word] and its de facto deconstructioners [in the West, the faustian men, who sell their soul for the sake of acquiring political power, wealth, or even fame.Well, it depends if you define Europe geographically or culturally. Personally I consider myself an ancestral and cultural European living in the North American continent. My ancestors just conquered the land from the tribes living here and brought Europe to North America and made North America European. Same with Central and South America which I would argue is yet another extension of Europe specifically the Iberian Peninsula while North America is an extension of the British Isles (and France in Quebec and Louisiana, and the Netherlands for that matter in the Greater New York area). The borders of Europe as a continent are defined culturally and ethnically rather than geographically anyways. It's that peninsula made of peninsulas jutting out of Asia with white, mostly Indo European, Christians with a common cultural heritage stemming from Ancient Greece, the Roman Empire, the Celtic, Germanic, and Slavic tribes, the culture of the Middle Ages, the Renaissance, the Enlightenment, Christianity and the like. I think it's all European civilization even outside of the borders of the landmass traditionally known as Europe so I think the term European Civilization would suffice for our purposes.
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Post by joustos on Nov 7, 2021 17:43:05 GMT
Let me be a self-critic. I listed seven qualities of Western/Occidental Man which are good and therefore are of good Western men, and, as in the old days, they can be called Virtues [manly qualities], but obviously there are also faustian [bad,corrupt] men ... who sell their soul in order to fulfill their ambitions. For the sake of contrast, and to stay within the diversity of men, we could speak of faustian and -- what? -- promethian men. The ancient mythical Promethius stole fire from heaven and brought it to men; my mythical Promethius invents fire and other things, is creative, does everything out of his own nature, and is strictly philanthropic. Yet he is punished (caused to fall, to lose his innate powers or accomplishments) by an external force, such as God [Zeus]. Why? Because of envy? Because of usurping divine power?In the case of promethian men, or promethian cultures, a downfall is brought about by foreigners (people of a different culture) who peacefully infiltrate a culture, manipulate the hosting culture, become parasites or, most importantly, create pretexts or provocations [like the destruction of the World Trade Center in N. Y. city] in order to make the hosting country subservient to its own military purposes [the destruction of Iraq while protecting their own skin and economy] ad majorem gloriam dei -- for the greater glory of God.
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lamburk
Full Member
Posts: 227
Likes: 80
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Post by lamburk on Dec 1, 2021 4:53:07 GMT
Various threads in this section ["History & Ethogenesis"] -- which are quite interesting to me-- have not been exhausted. So, I re-introduce some topics ["Western Man, Western Civilization"] which have been treated elsewhere and for a long time albeit, for me, without any final resolution: I question some of their views or theories. I will be specific, in case some of you are not already familiar with them. To begin with: To speak of Western/Occidental Man or Civilization is to deal with historical men, not with "Man" in the abstract [as an abstract concept]. Secondly, speaking of Occidental or of Oriental Man is to already classify humans according to a "flat Earth" geography which is antiquated in today's Western civilization -- my point being that any theory or conceptualization or discourse reflects moments of human history or, I dare say, moments of human ecology (the world as humans make it or conceive it, for themelves). Thirdly, speaking of historical men [as they are] is not meant to imply that men should be orought to be as they are known/described to be. // To continue
Whites Who Are Born Rich Hate and Fear All Other White PeopleHereditary wealth, business, political power, and cultural manipulation cause the carefully hidden cancer that has destroyed all civilizations. In the formerly United States, unearned and carcinogenic birth privileges reached their final stage of societal destruction during the Vietnam War, when how much money a young man's Daddy had determined whether he would live sheltered and safe or die in a jungle. All the juniorcrat rulers' bought and paid for historians intentionally ignore this key to understanding decline and fall. There is no reason to read these traitors, except to spy on them. The wannabe Preppies who ran away to college, which is an "heiristocratic" institution for non-entitled teenagers who are afraid to grow up, are insignificant followers. So the masses, by design, have no influence on decline. Not even their cowardice, slavishness, and stupidity are their own fault, but created by the pervasive control of Birth-Class Supremacy. This. I don't know, for how long this class division will prevail, and in that also, it's only uber rich, who decides, what's good for others.
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Post by thesageofmainstreet on Dec 1, 2021 23:06:59 GMT
Whites Who Are Born Rich Hate and Fear All Other White PeopleHereditary wealth, business, political power, and cultural manipulation cause the carefully hidden cancer that has destroyed all civilizations. In the formerly United States, unearned and carcinogenic birth privileges reached their final stage of societal destruction during the Vietnam War, when how much money a young man's Daddy had determined whether he would live sheltered and safe or die in a jungle. All the juniorcrat rulers' bought and paid for historians intentionally ignore this key to understanding decline and fall. There is no reason to read these traitors, except to spy on them. The wannabe Preppies who ran away to college, which is an "heiristocratic" institution for non-entitled teenagers who are afraid to grow up, are insignificant followers. So the masses, by design, have no influence on decline. Not even their cowardice, slavishness, and stupidity are their own fault, but created by the pervasive control of Birth-Class Supremacy. This. I don't know, for how long this class division will prevail, and in that also, it's only uber rich, who decides, what's good for others. Hackers, Aux Armes!In France, it had lasted 800 years before the Reign of Counter-Terror. No real men can wait that long. High IQs created all the Ubers excess wealth, so High IQs have the most reason and the most mental power to take it all back.
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Post by thesageofmainstreet on Dec 1, 2021 23:26:01 GMT
Final remarks about the proposed subject: To the extent that we can talk about the Western/Occidental/White/Indo-European Man (namely the men who produced their own cultures, or the Western civilization, I would say that {1} he possesses the Martial Spirit (namely the impulse to accomplish something great --to fulfill his needs etc. -- hence to create, to invent, to perfect, to discover; {2} he strives for excellence, which procures happiness for him, whether he be the architect Vitruvius or a shoemaker: an artefact has to e made so as to fit its intended function, has to be durable, and has to be beautiful; {3} He is courageous rather than cowardly, thus striving to overcome or dissipate obstacles or oppositions, regardless of sacrifices to himself, thus securing for himself the freedom of action that is required -- yes, Eugene, Freedom is one of the greatest things Occidental Man wants; {4} in his actions/deeds, he strives to be honorable, just, and loving, wherefore he sees these virtues as his duties [see Cicero], and to judge others in the proper manner (exemplified by Roman jurisprudence); {5} he is resilient, hence regenerative of his culture and innovative (not enslaved by his traditions or inheritance). I was about to complete the above discourse, but I responded to two responses. Now then, to continue: {6} he discovers and harnesses natural energies [animal muscle power; fire; flowing rivers; cascading water; wind; light; geothermal energy; and (recently) telluric magnetism (whereby to generate electricity by means of an orbiting rocket and a tethered "satellite"); and {7} he takes adversities in stride, but he has a tragic sense of life, he a lmortal amongst the immortals. // Those are seven qualities, the "magical seven" that belong also to, or proceed from, the (Greek-discovered) seen planets, night luminaries, children of Sky and Earth, replicated in Palestine's Feast of Lights or Seven Days of Generation/Creation: Moon/Selene/Luna, Ares/Mars, Hermes/Mercurius, Zeus/Jupiter, Aphrodite/Venus, Saturn, Sun/Apollo. Crucified on the Side of a Mountain, This Titan Will Destroy His Enemies Whenever He Mans Up and Walks Free and TallYou forgot Prometheus, the only god that really matters. Not as a god who saved helpless mankind, but as a symbol of the creative human geniuses who invented everything that prevents the rest of mankind from living like wild animals.
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