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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2018 15:35:57 GMT
Other cultures, Christianity (Specifically Catholicism) preached towards had to deal with the question of the cross and/or Crucifixion: I will post a few sources, they are not the best but they will do because of time constraints. 1) Quetzacoatal was crucified on a cross. www.supportingevidences.net/quetzalcoatl/2) Oden's hanging from the world tree (a pseudo-crucifixion). leejohnbarnes.blogspot.com/2008/ ... d-god.html 3) Cross (Ankh if I remember correctly) in Egyptian Culture. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ankh4) Cross in Native American Culture. www.warpaths2peacepipes.com/nat ... anings.htm 5) Prometheus having a pseudo-crucifixion. www.tektonics.org/copycat/promy.php6) etc...do the research yourself...it is interesting about the universality of the concept of the cross. Even the pythagoreans observed "10" as "x" being a form of synthesis where numbers reverted back to their original cycles while manifesting new ones. There is some deep "truth" in the symbol and questions pertaining to the "Cross" and the act of crucifixion. The question is what? www.ancientpages.com/2017/05/23/ ... explained/ The question on the nature of Crucifixion appears to be a universal archetype, in one form or another, through the human condition that represents not just a form of sacrifice, but the synthesis of life and death through the act of resurrection. In these respects we can come to a conclusion that the nature of "humanity" has a trifold nature of "life"(positive), "death"(death) and "resurrection" (as the neutral ground from which both stem) which mirrors the other trifold natures of reality (along with the Christian Trinity): 1,2,3 compose all further numbers including themselves. Line, point, circle form all foundations for spatial awareness. 1) frequency/intensity/duration 2) mean/median/mode 3) addition/multiplication/powers 4) subtraction/division/root 5) vertex/amplitude/depth 6) past/present/future 7) line/point(circle)/curve 8) being/form/function 9) (univeralisity/gradation)/(dynamic/static)/(abstract/physical) 10) letter/number/equation(sentence) 11) inductive/deductive/abductive reasoning 12) Mind/body/spirit 13) Reason/Spirit/Appetite (Blössner) 14) Productive/Protective/Governing classes of society (Lee) 15) Reflection/causality/randomness 16) Relation/probability/potential 17) Synthesis/Dimensions/Possibility 18) All through the minimum dimensions of 1, 2 and 3 from which infinite more triads may propagate. In simpler terms the human condition may have a stronger logical base than we may have previously suspected...given this very brief argument. Philosopher's such as Hall observed this in greater depth recycling back to the nature of Crucifixion: www.sacred-texts.com/eso/sta/sta45.htm
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mothman
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Post by mothman on May 25, 2018 10:08:56 GMT
I didn't know about Quetzacoatal.
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2018 13:56:23 GMT
I didn't know about Quetzacoatal. Some authors pointed out the problems it caused for the Catholic Priests doing conversions at the time. Often times, one case in particular comes to mind, they would just "redecorate the crosses".
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Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 15:18:33 GMT
The cross maybe not be a unique symbol, but the Crucifixion is unique!
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2018 15:26:26 GMT
The cross maybe not be a unique symbol, but the Crucifixion is unique! Quetzalcoatl was crucified. Vishnu is arguable but has similarities. Odin was hanged from a tree but pierced in the side by a spear. Images of Buddha often have rays of light extending from crucifixion points in hands and feet.
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Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 19:04:45 GMT
The cross maybe not be a unique symbol, but the Crucifixion is unique! Quetzalcoatl was crucified. Vishnu is arguable but has similarities. Odin was hanged from a tree but pierced in the side by a spear. Images of Buddha often have rays of light extending from crucifixion points in hands and feet. They are not historical personalities.
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2018 13:58:12 GMT
Quetzalcoatl was crucified. Vishnu is arguable but has similarities. Odin was hanged from a tree but pierced in the side by a spear. Images of Buddha often have rays of light extending from crucifixion points in hands and feet. They are not historical personalities. What we know is that they are myths and as myths they either represent a facet of the human sub-conscious, are based loosely upon some historical figure, and/or both. Considering the possibility they are archetypes they are taken for what they are. Considering the possibilty they are historical, and considering history is written by the culture, more evidence has to be brought for to either prove or disprove their existence as many of these record are either obscure (such as hinduism) or destroyed (Quetzalcoatl). Odin has been argued as "possibly" a historical figure. The mayans/aztecs thought the Conquistadors were representatives of Quetzalcoatl due to Quetzlcoatl "coming from a boat with a cross" in there history. Upon further inspection of memory I cannot remember if it came from the sky or sea.
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mothman
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Taxonomy: Homo Sapiens
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Post by mothman on May 27, 2018 5:23:43 GMT
I didn't know about Quetzacoatal. Some authors pointed out the problems it caused for the Catholic Priests doing conversions at the time. Often times, one case in particular comes to mind, they would just "redecorate the crosses". So Quetzalcoatl wasn't crucified but did have a cross as his symbol in some context.And monks just used the fact and added the crucified diety part? Why am I not surprised.
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fashtag
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Post by fashtag on May 28, 2018 9:16:00 GMT
I vaguely remember watching "Zeitgeist" and it mentioning the commonality of virgin birth, crucification and resurrection among many supposed deities of the past. It may very well be a trope. It would actually be very interesting to research failed/forgotten religions and their similarities. Another common story is one of a major flood. We do know that global sea levels did rise quickly in antiquity, flooding previously inhabited areas. It would make sense for such a major event to be echoed in myth as well. That would explain it's pervasiveness across cultures.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2018 14:07:48 GMT
Some authors pointed out the problems it caused for the Catholic Priests doing conversions at the time. Often times, one case in particular comes to mind, they would just "redecorate the crosses". So Quetzalcoatl wasn't crucified but did have a cross as his symbol in some context.And monks just used the fact and added the crucified diety part? Why am I not surprised. Quote source.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2018 12:27:19 GMT
The cross maybe not be a unique symbol, but the Crucifixion is unique! No, it's not unique even among the Mediterranean countries. In Plato's 'Menexenus' there is a place (I can't find it now, but I will if it's necessary) about crucifixion of enemies. Uniqueness of the Crucifixion is in not in the symbol, but in the sign: thesign was fulfilling of the prophecy (a shameful death); the sign showed us that Christ was tortured (He didn't kill himself). So, there's no point to talk about the Crucifixion as something new, because it's not influence on the liturgy cycle, and many other features in Christianity. I'd say that it should warn any christian to not to be involved in such conversations about uniqueness of the Crucifixion. Christian's belief is not in matter part, but in the spiritual part which's more important. Whether Christ died the unique death, or not - is not really important for believing in Him.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2018 18:28:42 GMT
What the crucifixion observes is a synthesis of extremes:
1) The vulnerability of life relative to the brutality of death with the synthesis being the agony of the human condition.
2) Two parallel lines, representing the four cardinal directions, merging with the origin point being that of man as the universal measurer through a metaphorical death of the psyche.
3) Death as a artificial contruct where the tree, as a symbol of life, is remeasured and formed into a tool of death and judgement through the self-will of man. Man sacrifices himself to himself through his own will.
4) The sacrifice of the weak on behalf of the state as a means to provide a cathartic spirituality that fuels the same civilization present. The execution of power through a ritual sacrifice under the form of judgement provides this nullification of the individual as a threat to the percieved power structure. Hence the nature of spiritual "life" versus "cathartic death" can be observed.
5) The cross, or "x", is observed in pythagorean quantiative terminology as "10" being a form of synthesis where the 1 and 0 transform into a whole new set of numbers.
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