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Post by DKTrav88 on Apr 21, 2018 7:58:49 GMT
www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevin-wax/johns-story-why-i-left-eastern-orthodoxy-for-evangelicalism/“I would have caved had I not begun reading the Bible the Baptists had given me,” John says with a smile. “As I began reading Scripture, I understood Jesus to be the only way to God. I realized I did not need the Orthodox church or even a priest to be my mediator, for Jesus was the mediator between me and the Father.” Though John does not use the term, it is clear from his testimony that he had acquired an unshakable belief in the Reformation doctrine of sola scriptura. “I realized that the Bible was the authority, even over the Church. The Bible was true, and the Church with all its traditions and rituals was wrong.” What do those who are members of the Orthodox Church think of this and the rest of what is said in the article?
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 21:55:24 GMT
Boring girls goodnightI never got a clear answer to my question! I was just interested in how Christians who, without Tradition, interpret the contradictions in the Bible .. Fox example: - Then came true that which was said by Jeremiah the prophet, And they took the thirty bits of silver, the price of him who was valued by the children of Israel- (Mt. 27: 3-10)! -And I will say unto them, If it please you, then give me my wages; if not, do not give it; and they will pay me thirty pieces of silver. 13 And the LORD said unto me, Throw them into the ecclesiastical vault, the high price in which they have valued me!- The Book of the Prophet Zechariah, Chapter 11 » arktos.boards.net/thread/130/belief I also did not receive, after many months from the Protestants, the answer to my claim that Ladan is important and that in the New Testament it was not abolished! I see perfectly wrong excuses why Tradition does not need even the Bible to talk about the opposite ( Second Epistle to Thessalonians, Chapter 3.6!)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2018 21:55:30 GMT
Thank you, Elizabeth for your answering, sorry, that I haven't answered in time (I was busy and... Well, today I have a too long and crazy day!.. I meet my friends which I haven't saw for ages. Well... crazy day..). Well, I want to say that I love you, DKTrav88, Διαμονδ, just10sp and the rest of my friends of Arktos. You guys are awesome, and I like to chat with you very much!! Ok, getting back to comments... I'm sorry that I won't use precise quotations and won't be answering at precise themes, but I want to summarize my answers, and to show my position on it. Firstly, I see that Protestants use individualistic understanding of Bible, which I mean as - everyone is able to understand the Bible. For example, you said that doctors, or teachers could be bad, and also that the one could cure oneself, and the one could teach oneself, if it would be possible. There's no objection at this while we understand that if a doctor, or a teacher is able to understand the path of medicine, or pedagogy, then everyone else can. I clearly understand it, but my thesis is not on 'ability to get a discipline/subject', but on atomization (individualization; well, the term 'atomization' belongs to Hanna Arendt) of society. I mean surely, each man or woman can understand Bible, and he/she may avoid services of someone else to understand the words of God. (I want to add here, that priests in Orthodoxy, as any other persons, are not authority as the same level as Gospels, or Acts, or Paul... they just do what they can do best, and also they continue to make rituals... Well, I leave this topic to another times, because I don't want to wide the subject.) I'm worrying of this individualization, because I see this a big problem. Technology is the one of something that comes to be medium between us, because it breaks simple relationship. But, even taking another examples we can see that our abilities of curing, teaching, translating, programming... etc are left out with another things. I can't break apart my understanding of Bible, books of philosophy, science, music, etc on the one hand, and processes in society on the other hand. I try to gather things, because all the processes which goes around are grouped. That's why I insist not using of ability of understanding Bible by a man/a woman, but on more higher things. Reading Bible we may not see another important things; and this is not a call to leave teaching of Bible, but a claim to leave our questions of methods of interpretations (or just of simple reading, if dktrav88 don't agree with me on it), but on some other important things that hides behind it. I beg you to understand me correctly: Reading/understanding/teaching/interpretating/... of Bible is not enough for us all, and separating it from other things may be very dangerous. What profit would be for us while reading Bible we would bury something good? Luv ya all!
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 21:59:19 GMT
Boring girls goodnightI never got a clear answer to my question! I was just interested in how Christians who, without Tradition, interpret the contradictions in the Bible .. Fox example: - Then came true that which was said by Jeremiah the prophet, And they took the thirty bits of silver, the price of him who was valued by the children of Israel- (Mt. 27: 3-10)! -And I will say unto them, If it please you, then give me my wages; if not, do not give it; and they will pay me thirty pieces of silver. 13 And the LORD said unto me, Throw them into the ecclesiastical vault, the high price in which they have valued me!- The Book of the Prophet Zechariah, Chapter 11 » arktos.boards.net/thread/130/belief I also did not receive, after many months from the Protestants, the answer to my claim that Ladan is important and that in the New Testament it was not abolished! I see perfectly wrong excuses why Tradition does not need even the Bible to talk about the opposite ( Second Epistle to Thessalonians, Chapter 3.6!) What does a prophecy about Jesus being sold fpr 30 pieces of silver have to do with tradition? The prophecy is just there to prove Jesus fulfilled it. That's it. It must be mentioned in New Testament to show Jesus fulfilled all prophecies.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 22:05:36 GMT
Boring girls goodnightI never got a clear answer to my question! I was just interested in how Christians who, without Tradition, interpret the contradictions in the Bible .. Fox example: - Then came true that which was said by Jeremiah the prophet, And they took the thirty bits of silver, the price of him who was valued by the children of Israel- (Mt. 27: 3-10)! -And I will say unto them, If it please you, then give me my wages; if not, do not give it; and they will pay me thirty pieces of silver. 13 And the LORD said unto me, Throw them into the ecclesiastical vault, the high price in which they have valued me!- The Book of the Prophet Zechariah, Chapter 11 » arktos.boards.net/thread/130/belief I also did not receive, after many months from the Protestants, the answer to my claim that Ladan is important and that in the New Testament it was not abolished! I see perfectly wrong excuses why Tradition does not need even the Bible to talk about the opposite ( Second Epistle to Thessalonians, Chapter 3.6!) What does a prophecy about Jesus being sold fpr 30 pieces of silver have to do with tradition? The prophecy is just there to prove Jesus fulfilled it. That's it. It must be mentioned in New Testament to show Jesus fulfilled all prophecies. Do not you get the gist of the question? In the Bible there is a supposedly 'contradiction' to which atheists appeal, but this contradiction is only external, not in fact ... the person to whom God taught to understand the Scriptures will easily understand everything and will not postpone his answer 100 times! Разве вы не понимаете суть вопроса? В Библии есть якобы «противоречие», к которому обращаются атеисты, но это противоречие только внешнее, а не на самом деле ... человек, которому Бог учил понимать Писание, легко все понимает и не будет откладывать свой ответ в 100 раз !
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 22:08:12 GMT
unknown I want to add here, that priests in Orthodoxy, as any other persons, are not authority as the same level as Gospels, or Acts, or Paul...
Yes, because Paul's authority is Christ and a priest's authority must be Christ. So yeah they can do their thing and be under Christ's authority and serve Him. And I will do my part under Christ's authority and server Him without interruption. The relationship is between you and God so that's the relationship to worry about. What other are doing is between them and God. It has nothing to do with me since I cannot save anyone since only Jesus can save.
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 22:09:13 GMT
What does a prophecy about Jesus being sold fpr 30 pieces of silver have to do with tradition? The prophecy is just there to prove Jesus fulfilled it. That's it. It must be mentioned in New Testament to show Jesus fulfilled all prophecies. Do not you get the gist of the question? In the Bible there is a supposedly 'contradiction' to which atheists appeal, but this contradiction is only external, not in fact ... the person to whom God taught to understand the Scriptures will easily understand everything and will not postpone his answer 100 times! Разве вы не понимаете суть вопроса? В Библии есть якобы «противоречие», к которому обращаются атеисты, но это противоречие только внешнее, а не на самом деле ... человек, которому Бог учил понимать Писание, легко все понимает и не будет откладывать свой ответ в 100 раз ! I answered your question about tradition right away. And that the prophecy is about Jesus.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 22:10:09 GMT
Протестанта не волнует вся правда! Они видят Библии и верят в нее суть любой религии Shrug истоки Библии в том что она передавалась от апостолов(вместе с Преданиям) к ранней церкви(Отцы церкви) их не волнует... конечно человек спасаеться по благодати Божьей, но без правильного подхода этот путь будет труднее чем православному!
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 22:14:20 GMT
Протестанта не волнует вся правда! Они видят Библии и верят в нее суть любой религии Shrug истоки Библии в том что она передавалась от апостолов(вместе с Преданиям) к ранней церкви(Отцы церкви) их не волнует... конечно человек спасаеться по благодати Божьей, но без правильного подхода этот путь будет труднее чем православному! The bible is the whole truth silly! XD But yes we believe the bible over all other religions since Christianity is New Testament.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 22:16:51 GMT
Протестанта не волнует вся правда! Они видят Библии и верят в нее суть любой религии истоки Библии в том что она передавалась от апостолов(вместе с Преданиям) к ранней церкви(Отцы церкви) их не волнует... конечно человек спасаеться по благодати Божьей, но без правильного подхода этот путь будет труднее чем православному! The bible is the whole truth silly! XD But yes we believe the bible over all other religions since Christianity is New Testament. Я получу ответ на счет ладана?Уже много месяцов жду и вижу что у тебя нет что сказать!
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 22:18:19 GMT
The bible is the whole truth silly! XD But yes we believe the bible over all other religions since Christianity is New Testament. Я получу ответ на счет ладана?Уже много месяцов жду и вижу что у тебя нет что сказать! What is your question and tell me the verse. I still don't know what prophesies or ladan have to do with traditions. O.o
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 22:19:55 GMT
Я получу ответ на счет ладана?Уже много месяцов жду и вижу что у тебя нет что сказать! What is your question and tell me the verse. I still don't know what prophesies or ladan have to do with traditions. O.o Read this please! arktos.boards.net/thread/130/belief
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 22:22:20 GMT
Yes, I read that thread. I made the thread. What is the question and the bible verse? Because I just see traditions people made up and traditions God didn't make.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 22:28:17 GMT
Yes, I read that thread. I made the thread. What is the question and the bible verse? Because I just see traditions people made up and traditions God didn't make. Вопрос в том почему протестанты не используют ладан и кадильницу хотя Библия говорит об этом - Сам Господь Сущий в Ветхом Завете повелел Моисею сделать в скинии особый жертвенник для священного курения ароматических веществ (Исх. 30:1-9). Волхвы, пришедшие поклониться Христу, среди прочих даров поднесли Христу ладан (Мф. 2:11). Евангелист Иоанн Богослов описал в Откровении бывшее ему видение в Небесном храме Ангела, приемлющего золотую кадильницу (Откр. 8:3) Ладан использували в храме Иерусалима например отец Иоанна Крестителя! Каждение столь приятно Богу, что в Ветхом Завете Моисей каждением фимиама остановил гнев Божий на Израиля за непослушание (Чис. 16, 46-48; Прем. 18, 21 И нигде в Новом завете это не отменено!
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Post by Elizabeth on Apr 21, 2018 22:32:36 GMT
Yes, I read that thread. I made the thread. What is the question and the bible verse? Because I just see traditions people made up and traditions God didn't make. Вопрос в том почему протестанты не используют ладан и кадильницу хотя Библия говорит об этом - Сам Господь Сущий в Ветхом Завете повелел Моисею сделать в скинии особый жертвенник для священного курения ароматических веществ (Исх. 30:1-9). Волхвы, пришедшие поклониться Христу, среди прочих даров поднесли Христу ладан (Мф. 2:11). Евангелист Иоанн Богослов описал в Откровении бывшее ему видение в Небесном храме Ангела, приемлющего золотую кадильницу (Откр. 8:3) Ладан использували в храме Иерусалима например отец Иоанна Крестителя! Каждение столь приятно Богу, что в Ветхом Завете Моисей каждением фимиама остановил гнев Божий на Израиля за непослушание (Чис. 16, 46-48; Прем. 18, 21 И нигде в Новом завете это не отменено! Where did Jesus do this? Jesus taught us to do the Lord's Super, to preach, to be baptized, and to baptize, and to obey the commandments. Where did Jesus do this ladan thing and teach us to do it?
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 21, 2018 22:44:19 GMT
Вопрос в том почему протестанты не используют ладан и кадильницу хотя Библия говорит об этом - Сам Господь Сущий в Ветхом Завете повелел Моисею сделать в скинии особый жертвенник для священного курения ароматических веществ (Исх. 30:1-9). Волхвы, пришедшие поклониться Христу, среди прочих даров поднесли Христу ладан (Мф. 2:11). Евангелист Иоанн Богослов описал в Откровении бывшее ему видение в Небесном храме Ангела, приемлющего золотую кадильницу (Откр. 8:3) Ладан использували в храме Иерусалима например отец Иоанна Крестителя! Каждение столь приятно Богу, что в Ветхом Завете Моисей каждением фимиама остановил гнев Божий на Израиля за непослушание (Чис. 16, 46-48; Прем. 18, 21 И нигде в Новом завете это не отменено! Where did Jesus do this? Jesus taught us to do the Lord's Super, to preach, to be baptized, and to baptize, and to obey the commandments. Where did Jesus do this ladan thing and teach us to do it? Well, if Protestants understand only the letter of Scripture, it's only their problem! Shrug 6-He gave us the ability to be ministers of the New Testament, not letters, but of the Spirit, because the letter kills, but the Spirit animates.- The Second Epistle to the Corinthians!
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