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Post by oluwamayokun on Nov 7, 2017 6:18:32 GMT
Does Satan really exit? How did God and Satan come into existence
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Post by Elizabeth on Nov 7, 2017 6:34:31 GMT
Ok here's my perspective.
Both God and Satan exist. God was just always there and wasn't created like gold to get into science a bit. Gold is found in nature only. Satan was first created as an angel. A powerful and most beautiful of all angels to help God out. He was supposed to be God's helper with the one closest to God's power but Lucifer went nuts over all the power he had and wanted to reject God and make his one Kingdom. Therefore, Lucifer became satan and took his angel friends with him. My religious study there xD
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Post by Διαμονδ on Nov 7, 2017 7:49:54 GMT
Ok here's my perspective. Both God and Satan exist. God was just always there and wasn't created like gold to get into science a bit. Gold is found in nature only. Satan was first created as an angel. A powerful and most beautiful of all angels to help God out. He was supposed to be God's helper with the one closest to God's power but Lucifer went nuts over all the power he had and wanted to reject God and make his one Kingdom. Therefore, Lucifer became satan and took his angel friends with him. My religious study there xD You're right! Satan wants to steal mankind from God in order to be in his place. God gave man a free choice between him and his enemy!
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Post by Elizabeth on Nov 7, 2017 23:38:45 GMT
My question is why is satan trying to fight God when he is weaker than God? If you can't win a fight like that why even bother trying? Hmm.
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Post by Sarmatian on Nov 8, 2017 5:54:55 GMT
My question is why is satan trying to fight God when he is weaker than God? If you can't win a fight like that why even bother trying? Hmm. The right question should be why his name is Lucifer?
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Post by Elizabeth on Nov 8, 2017 6:02:21 GMT
My question is why is satan trying to fight God when he is weaker than God? If you can't win a fight like that why even bother trying? Hmm. The right question should be why his name is Lucifer? Because he was a special angel who was most powerful like the right hanf of God basically. Or do you have other ideas? Lucifer had a good meaning but it lost its value...
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Post by Sarmatian on Nov 8, 2017 6:16:12 GMT
The right question should be why his name is Lucifer? Because he was a special angel who was most powerful like the right hanf of God basically. Or do you have other ideas? Lucifer had a good meaning but it lost its value...
He was never right hand of God. He was and remains the left hand of God. And he was trickster from very beginning. He was the one who seduced Lilith.
His name is Lucifer because that's his main function - to illuminate the total darkness that is outside of our Universe. He is in this special position when he looking with one eye into our world but with another into that darkness of nothing. It's not even darkness of death, it's much worse as death in our world always followed by rebirth. That's what makes him exceptional and very powerful as he is responsible for expansion of our Universe. But any fool trying to serve him makes him laugh. No mortal being could touch that darkness and remain to be, he will cease to exist, his very soul will disappear. Only Lucifer could touch it and remain to exist, he is unique in that and destined to remain in that thin border between us and nothingness alone for as long as Universe will exist.
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Post by Elizabeth on Nov 8, 2017 6:19:44 GMT
Because he was a special angel who was most powerful like the right hanf of God basically. Or do you have other ideas? Lucifer had a good meaning but it lost its value...
He was never right hand of God. He was and remains the left hand of God. And he was trickster from very beginning. He was the one who seduced Lilith.
His name is Lucifer because that's his main function - to illuminate the total darkness that is outside of our Universe. He is in this special position when he looking with one eye into our world but with another into that darkness of nothing. It's not even darkness of death, it's much worse as death in our world always followed by rebirth. That's what makes him exceptional and very powerful as he is responsible for expansion of our Universe. But any fool trying to serve him makes him laugh. No mortal being could touch that darkness and remain to be, he will cease to exist, his very soul will disappear. Only Lucifer could touch it and remain to exist, he is unique in that and destined to remain in that thin border between us and nothingness alone for as long as Universe will exist.
No, I didn't say he WAS the right hand of God but that he was LIKE the right hand of God. In terms off being right below God in power. The rest of what you said I can't disagree on much
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Post by Διαμονδ on Nov 8, 2017 6:21:28 GMT
Lilith? She is from Kabbalistic mythology
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Post by Sarmatian on Nov 8, 2017 6:35:07 GMT
Lilith? She is from Kabbalistic mythology
Yes. Her story taken place long before Jesus.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Nov 8, 2017 6:41:56 GMT
Lilith? She is from Kabbalistic mythology
Yes. Her story taken place long before Jesus.
But in the Christian tradition, this view is rejected! You probably confused her with Eve!
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Post by Sarmatian on Nov 8, 2017 7:25:57 GMT
Yes. Her story taken place long before Jesus.
But in the Christian tradition, this view is rejected! You probably confused her with Eve!
No. Eve was created after Lilith rejected Adam and was seduced by Lucifer. After that she turned to female demon responsible for deaths of little kids as she later became jealous of Eve being happy faithful wife for Adam.
PS Another difference is Lilith was created from night sky, Eve was created from Adam's rib.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Nov 8, 2017 12:09:35 GMT
My question is why is satan trying to fight God when he is weaker than God? If you can't win a fight like that why even bother trying? Hmm. I will simply say that the meaning of life to Satan, the struggle with God! He knows that he is doomed! But his task is to destroy also humanity!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2017 12:41:52 GMT
My question is why is satan trying to fight God when he is weaker than God? If you can't win a fight like that why even bother trying? Hmm. Does Satan (in religions that have a fundament in the Old Testament) actually tries to fight God, or human instead? In various places in the Bible it is said that God and Satan were making certain deals (Job), and it is said that Satan will be an opponent of every individual person during the Final Judgement, providing "the list" of sins. To me it looks rather like Satan has its own mission to tempt people during their lives and to prove they don't deserve salvation. I don't remember any particular moments from the Bible where Satan tries to fight God. Even when he was supposed to tempt Jesus, he was tempting him to prove that his human side is stronger and that he will fall. But even then, there was no actual fight between them. PS. According to some exorcists and other "experts" on the topic of demonology, Satan and Lucifer are two different fallen angels, not the same one.
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Post by Elizabeth on Nov 8, 2017 21:35:26 GMT
My question is why is satan trying to fight God when he is weaker than God? If you can't win a fight like that why even bother trying? Hmm. Does Satan (in religions that have a fundament in the Old Testament) actually tries to fight God, or human instead? Why humans? He is stronger than humans in every way unless those humans are under God's protection. He is just trying to win humans over (to take souls) so they will not be saved and end up in the lake of fire. So, he is just fighting with God for souls while still fighting to replace God (which is why he tempted Jesus to sin to try to beat God at any chance he could but God is too smart for him). But the fight that started is still in heaven. Lucifer rebels against God and wanted to replace Him as Isaiah chapter 14:12-13 mentions, "How you are fallen from heaven, O Day Star, son of Dawn! How you are cut down to the ground, you who laid the nations low! You said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven; above the stars of God. I will set my throne on high." But instead his pride got him kicked out of heaven and yet to this day he's fighting for what he always wanted despite miserably failing. So, hope I understood you well enough to respond correctly. Of course, yes. Well, book of Job also shows how satan is weak and needs God's permission to even do anything! So, how he plans to become God while not being able to do anything despite God's approval is just his delusions . But, yes, he does make deals. Satan wants things but He needs God's permission and timing approval. So, Satan wanted all this bad stuff for Job to tell God that Job will hate and reject Him and the soul will belong to satan. God told him Job is His but if Satan wants to see for himself he can do whatever he wanted but not kill Job. See, God laid out the rules since Satan can't do nothing himself otherwise. Yes, he wants them all in the lake of fire. He will use trickery or any means possible to succeed. As, I said above he rebels to become God and is fighting God for souls despite being blind that yet he can win win most humans he can't win against God or His people. Otherwise, he and God do communicate fine as in Job's story because little Lucifer always needs permission Yeah, I just stick to what's in the bible so no comment there. :/
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