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Post by joustos on Jul 24, 2020 22:31:01 GMT
In ancient agricultural towns, a black hole was simply a hole in the ground used for collecting sewer. It mattered for the sanitation of the population, and the contents could be used as fertilizers. In modern cities, they are also called sewer holes, are covered, and are part of a pipe sewer system. In astronomy, a black hole is a space location whence not even light can escape, but obviously it collects startlight…. (Add details and purpose/) Can there be a black hole in some peoples' heads? |
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Post by karl on Jul 24, 2020 22:44:14 GMT
In ancient agricultural towns, a black hole was simply a hole in the ground used for collecting sewer. It mattered for the sanitation of the population, and the contents could be used as fertilizers. In modern cities, they are also called sewer holes, are covered, and are part of a pipe sewer system. In astronomy, a black hole is a space location whence not even light can escape, but obviously it collects startlight…. (Add details and purpose/) Can there be a black hole in some peoples' heads?
I'm not sure whether to read this as a critique of the concept of the astronomical black hole, or of the mindless majority.
As for the astronomical black hole, from the perspective of the external observer, nothing can enter the black hole as it can never reach the event horizon. However, I know the mathematics of this well enough to state that this presentation needs a qualifier. It's only for the suspended, external observer that nothing can enter the event horizon. According to the reference frame of the falling observer, something traveling ahead of him/her can cross the event horizon, but if he/she fires up the jetpack to prevent him/herself from falling in, this "unhappens". Now, just to clarify, I don't actually believe that anything can unhappen, and to me this merely implies that there is something lacking in one's understanding of black holes specifically, and by extension, general relativity.
The light that is inside the black hole and cannot escape, from the viewpoint of the suspended, external observer, is the light that was trapped by the collapse of the star.
From the viewpoint of the falling observer, if I let myself fall beyond the event horizon, and I shine light in the direction of the event horizon I just passed, it can't catch up with it, due to that the even horizon, from my perspective, moves away from me at the speed of light. Just one second after I passed the event horizon, I'm almost as far away from it as the distance from the Earth to the moon.
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Post by karl on Jul 24, 2020 23:26:52 GMT
I only just realised the title of the original post was a reference to "Black lives matter". But I'd much rather discuss astrophysics.
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Post by joustos on Jul 26, 2020 2:10:27 GMT
In ancient agricultural towns, a black hole was simply a hole in the ground used for collecting sewer. It mattered for the sanitation of the population, and the contents could be used as fertilizers. In modern cities, they are also called sewer holes, are covered, and are part of a pipe sewer system. In astronomy, a black hole is a space location whence not even light can escape, but obviously it collects startlight…. (Add details and purpose/) Can there be a black hole in some peoples' heads? To this brief inventory of Black Holes, I must add the term as used in Italy: Buco Nero. There it means essentially a bottomless pit. For instance, a city politician manages to get some millions of Euro or Dollars for local public works or maintainance, but this money disappears as if it were dropped in a buco Nero (bottomless pit). Of course everybody know that at the bottom of the pit there are the politician's pockets, but if he is a member of the same party which is in power, he enjoys immunity. It is thus that a black hole matters to him; he is enriched for life. I am still waiting for somebody's interpretation of a Black Hole in the head.
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Post by karl on Jul 26, 2020 8:13:31 GMT
In ancient agricultural towns, a black hole was simply a hole in the ground used for collecting sewer. It mattered for the sanitation of the population, and the contents could be used as fertilizers. In modern cities, they are also called sewer holes, are covered, and are part of a pipe sewer system. In astronomy, a black hole is a space location whence not even light can escape, but obviously it collects startlight…. (Add details and purpose/) Can there be a black hole in some peoples' heads? To this brief inventory of Black Holes, I must add the term as used in Italy: Buco Nero. There it means essentially a bottomless pit. For instance, a city politician manages to get some millions of Euro or Dollars for local public works or maintainance, but this money disappears as if it were dropped in a buco Nero (bottomless pit). Of course everybody know that at the bottom of the pit there are the politician's pockets, but if he is a member of the same party which is in power, he enjoys immunity. It is thus that a black hole matters to him; he is enriched for life. I am still waiting for somebody's interpretation of a Black Hole in the head.
The majority's willingness to trade privacy for convenience have had me conclude that they all have a Black Hole in their heads.
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Post by joustos on Jul 27, 2020 17:33:37 GMT
Other black holes that matter are the ancient and medieval pits in the ground that were used for burials. Also some churches still contains the remains of people buried under the church floor. It must have been a privilege (if not a necessity) to be buried so close to the tabernacle of the Lord. Of course, non-believers and heretics would not be taken to church at all and, having missed the "Requiem" prayers or Mass, their spirits are still restless or wandering around. Being laid in a black hole mattered most....
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Clovis Merovingian
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Jul 28, 2020 1:42:14 GMT
#allholesmatter! It's racist if you only care about black holes!  |
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Post by fschmidt on Jul 28, 2020 6:30:56 GMT
Can there be a black hole in some peoples' heads? Yes, their pupils. And if you look into their eyes, you can see the infinite void in their head. |
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Post by jonbain on Jul 28, 2020 15:41:25 GMT
black holes are a myth easily disproved
the 2017 nobel prize was awarded for
'observation of black-holes proving that gravity moves at the speed of light'
- this was the so-called proof of Einstein's 'gravitational waves'
nothing gets out of a black-hole that moves at light-speed?
but gravitational waves move at light-speed and they were being emitted by black holes?
thus disproving the value of the Nobel prize, and the entire disintegration of
western academia into nothing more than a funding farce of sheer corruption
enter:
fake virus media frenzy
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Post by karl on Jul 29, 2020 4:49:41 GMT
black holes are a myth easily disproved the 2017 nobel prize was awarded for 'observation of black-holes proving that gravity moves at the speed of light' - this was the so-called proof of Einstein's 'gravitational waves' nothing gets out of a black-hole that moves at light-speed? but gravitational waves move at light-speed and they were being emitted by black holes? thus disproving the value of the Nobel prize, and the entire disintegration of western academia into nothing more than a funding farce of sheer corruption enter: fake virus media frenzy
If there was a gravitational wave on the inside of a collapsing star as the event horizon was formed, then that wouldn't be able to escape. But a black hole makes an imprint on spacetime outside of the event horizon, and if that imprint is rapidly changed, like when two black holes rotate around each other, it will lead to gravitational waves. It's similar to someone driving a boat in a circle. For every round, it creates a new wake, amounting to a spiral of waves.
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Post by jonbain on Jul 29, 2020 20:59:50 GMT
black holes are a myth easily disproved the 2017 nobel prize was awarded for 'observation of black-holes proving that gravity moves at the speed of light' - this was the so-called proof of Einstein's 'gravitational waves' nothing gets out of a black-hole that moves at light-speed? but gravitational waves move at light-speed and they were being emitted by black holes? thus disproving the value of the Nobel prize, and the entire disintegration of western academia into nothing more than a funding farce of sheer corruption enter: fake virus media frenzy
If there was a gravitational wave on the inside of a collapsing star as the event horizon was formed, then that wouldn't be able to escape. But a black hole makes an imprint on spacetime outside of the event horizon, and if that imprint is rapidly changed, like when two black holes rotate around each other, it will lead to gravitational waves. It's similar to someone driving a boat in a circle. For every round, it creates a new wake, amounting to a spiral of waves.
Illogical. When the wave departs the edge of the boat it has to be able to get away from the edge of the boat. In 'black-hole theory', nothing gets past the edge.
Whatever gravity 'imprint' is beyond the edge as it 'forms' would depart or be sucked back in. After that nothing would be able to depart.
So to say that something departs is blatant contradiction.
Its like claiming that all triangles have three sides, and then claiming that you have a four-sided triangle.
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Post by joustos on Jul 29, 2020 22:29:15 GMT
#allholesmatter! It's racist if you only care about black holes! Are there races of holes (like breeds of dogs)? |
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Post by karl on Jul 29, 2020 23:09:48 GMT
If there was a gravitational wave on the inside of a collapsing star as the event horizon was formed, then that wouldn't be able to escape. But a black hole makes an imprint on spacetime outside of the event horizon, and if that imprint is rapidly changed, like when two black holes rotate around each other, it will lead to gravitational waves. It's similar to someone driving a boat in a circle. For every round, it creates a new wake, amounting to a spiral of waves.
Illogical. When the wave departs the edge of the boat it has to be able to get away from the edge of the boat. In 'black-hole theory', nothing gets past the edge.
Whatever gravity 'imprint' is beyond the edge as it 'forms' would depart or be sucked back in. After that nothing would be able to depart.
So to say that something departs is blatant contradiction.
Its like claiming that all triangles have three sides, and then claiming that you have a four-sided triangle.
I should have made it clear that when I wrote "similar" I didn't mean "identical". Yes, the analogy fails if it's taken to mean that something can propagate from the event horizon, like it would from the edge of the boat.
If we only focus on the mathematics of general relativity, and are not concerned with quantum mechanics, then an event horizon takes an infinite amount of time to form. If we apply this to two black holes emerging, then the merging will drag out forever from the viewpoint of the external observer. The effect that these black holes have on spacetime, doesn't come from the event horizon. If, for example, our sun were to suddenly start collapsing into a black hole (it's not heavy enough for that, but let's ignore that for the simplicity of the argument), then its past effect on spacetime would still remain. In regards to how the sun's gravitation affects the Earth, nothing would change, and the Earth would continue its orbit around the sun as if nothing had happened.
Do I personally think that how event horizon is described adds up perfectly? No, I don't. There is something that doesn't add up. I mentioned that according to relativity, the event horizon takes forever to form. But, according to the same mathematics, the event horizon will have formed for the falling observer, as he/she crosses the event horizon. In fact, it will even have happened according to the falling observer, before he crosses the event horizon, and if he then starts his jetpack to prevent himself from falling in, the forming of the event horizon will have "unhappened", and he will now instead claim that it's instead in the process of forming. This leads to an apparent paradox, which one has tried to solve with what's referred to the holographic principle. This also addresses another problem, which is that if you let something fall towards the event horizon, it will eventually be closer to it than one planck length. Also, its own length will keep shortening towards becoming infinitesimal small. When one tries to combine this with quantum mechanics, it becomes rather chaotic. When an object is close enough to the event horizon, then according to the uncertainty principle, one cannot even know whether it's on the inside or the outside of it.
One sign of that something is wrong is when theorists just add more assumptions into the mix, creating an ever less manageable complexity that no one really knows how to deal with. That is how I see the current state of physics.
To sum it up; While you reject the relativity theory, I see it as an incomplete theory that is able to describe more than it's able to explain.
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Clovis Merovingian
Prestige/VIP
Elder
Posts: 2,689
Likes: 1,757
Meta-Ethnicity: Anglo-American
Ethnicity: Deep Southerner
Country: My State and my Region are my country
Region: The Deep South
Location: South Carolina
Ancestry: Gaelic (patrilineal), English, Ulster Scots/Scots Irish, Scottish, German, Swiss German, Swedish, Manx, Finnish, Norman French/Quebecois (distantly), Dutch (distantly)
Taxonomy: Borreby/Alpine/ Nordid mix
Y-DNA: R-S660/R-DF109
mtDNA: T1a1
Politics: Conservative
Religion: Christian
Hero: Andrew Jackson, Thomas Jefferson, James K. Polk
Age: 30
Philosophy: I try to find out what is true as best I can.
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Post by Clovis Merovingian on Jul 30, 2020 1:11:49 GMT
#allholesmatter! It's racist if you only care about black holes! Are there races of holes (like breeds of dogs)? Nah, i'm joking. Though who knows what alien life exists out there. Maybe there are races of holes in space.  |
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Post by joustos on Jul 30, 2020 16:28:44 GMT
I like jokes, but seriously, there cannot be holes in space at all, since space is a hole... without walls. A Black Hole is like a well, walled, despite its aversion to walls or boundaries...…...  |
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