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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 12, 2018 3:20:07 GMT
A side by side comparison of Roman Catholic teachings and Biblical doctrine. Roman Catholic Teachings
1)The bishops, with the pope as their head, rule the universal Church.
2)God has entrusted revelation to the bishops.
3)The pope is infallible in his teaching.
4)Scripture and Tradition together are the Word of God.
5)Mary is the co-redeemer, for she participated with Christ in the painful act of redemption.
6)Mary is the co-mediator, to whom we can entrust all our cares and petitions.
7)Initial justification is by means of baptism.
8)Adults must prepare for justification through faith and good works.
9)Grace is merited by good works.
10)Salvation is attained by cooperating with grace through faith, good works, and participation in the sacraments.
11)No one can know if he will attain to eternal life.
12)The Roman Catholic Church is necessary for salvation.
13)Christ's body and blood exist wholly and entirely in every fragment of consecrated bread and wine in every Roman Catholic church around the world.
14)The sacrifice of the cross is perpetuated in the sacrifice of the Mass.
15)Each sacrifice of the Mass appeases God's wrath against sin.
16)The sacrificial work of redemption is continually carried out through the sacrifice of the Mass.
| Biblical Doctrine
1)Christ, the head of the body, rules the universal church (Colossians 1:18).
2)God has entrusted revelation to the saints (Jude 3).
3)God alone is infallible (Numbers 23:19; Acts 17:11).
4)Scripture alone is the Word of God (John 10:35; 2 Timothy 3:16,17; 2 Peter 1:20,21; Mark 7:1-13).
5)Christ alone is the Redeemer, for He alone suffered and died for sin (1 Peter 1:18,19).
6)Christ Jesus is the one mediator to whom we can entrust all our cares and petitions (1 Timothy 2:5; John 14:13,14; 1 Peter 5:7).
7)Justification is by faith alone (Romans 3:28).
8)God justifies ungodly sinners who believe (Romans 4:5). Good works are the result of salvation, not the cause (Ephesians 2:8-10).
9)Grace is a free gift (Romans 11:6).
10)Salvation is attained by grace through faith apart from works (Ephesians 2:10).
11)The believer can know that he has eternal life by the Word of God and the testimony of the Holy Spirit who indwells believers (1 John 5:13; Romans 8:16).
12)There is salvation in no one but the Lord Jesus Christ, “for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved” (Acts 4:12).
13)The bread and wine are symbols of the body and blood of Christ, and He is bodily present in heaven (1 Corinthians 11:23-25; Hebrews 10:12,13).
14)The sacrifice of the cross is finished (John 19:30).
15)The once-for-all sacrifice of the cross fully appeased God's wrath against sin (Hebrews 10:12-18).
16)The sacrificial work of redemption was finished when Christ gave His life for us on the cross (Ephesians 1:7; Hebrews 1:3). |
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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 19, 2018 20:39:55 GMT
Yes, but we're talking about what scripture calls it. Anyway here's if you don't believe the bible I'll use earthly sources. Paul wrote that book of Timothy to a building to address people's roles in the building. "To whom was it written? 1 Timothy is one of Paul’s “pastoral” letters. These letters were addressed to church leaders and outlined their pastoral duties." Taken out from... www.biblegateway.com/blog/2016/03/letters-to-the-church-pauls-first-letter-to-timothy/So like all the letters were addressed to individual church buildings to make sure they conducted things right. It's its own entity. As a marriage is its own entity where only 2 are present. These two concepts don't involve the whole sheep church. It's not all husbands are head of one wife. But one husband head over one wife and the rest of the sheep not present in it. Same as in a church building. There's roles for some and not for others to do. Scripture does call the church a group of people, not a building, as such: In the Bible the word church is a translation of the Greek word ekklesia , meaning “a calling out.” It never refers to a building or meeting place, but always to people, the ones “called out” of the world’s society by God calling them into His service. The Church of the Bible is not a cold, stone building, but a group of warm and loving people specially chosen by God.
The letter's as "greek" in origin explicitly state this...hence it is scriptural.
And don't back track on timothy, it is not about husband's and wives.....
You and Dk are literally forming your own interpretations....it is a cult nothing more. I dealt with them before with relatives.
“it is not about husband's and wives.....” Did you come up with that interpretation yourself?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:42:11 GMT
Scripture does call the church a group of people, not a building, as such: In the Bible the word church is a translation of the Greek word ekklesia , meaning “a calling out.” It never refers to a building or meeting place, but always to people, the ones “called out” of the world’s society by God calling them into His service. The Church of the Bible is not a cold, stone building, but a group of warm and loving people specially chosen by God.
The letter's as "greek" in origin explicitly state this...hence it is scriptural.
And don't back track on timothy, it is not about husband's and wives.....
You and Dk are literally forming your own interpretations....it is a cult nothing more. I dealt with them before with relatives.
Did I just not quote a verse that calls it a building too? Or would you like more verses? It was addressed to a "church leader"...a person the head of a congregation. You did not quote any verse, and the blog does not equate the church to a building at all. Try again.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:43:13 GMT
If you can't, the you are picking whatever verses you choose and the arguments you make are subjective. Unless you know the whole book, and I doubt you do inside and out, you cannot put things into context on your own. What? You really want me to quote all of Timothy 1 right here? this is getting stupid. 1 Timothy is considered a pastoral epistle, they are addressed to individuals with pastoral oversight of churches and discuss issues of Christian living, doctrine, and leadership. These epistles are for church conduct. Yes, the conduct of the congregation (not a building) and the behavior of women regardless of whether or not they are married.
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 19, 2018 20:43:29 GMT
If you can't, the you are picking whatever verses you choose and the arguments you make are subjective. Unless you know the whole book, and I doubt you do inside and out, you cannot put things into context on your own. What? You really want me to quote all of Timothy 1 right here? this is getting stupid. 1 Timothy is considered a pastoral epistle, they are addressed to individuals with pastoral oversight of churches and discuss issues of Christian living, doctrine, and leadership. These epistles are for church conduct. I'm started to think he's just messing with us. I mean all of Paul's epistles are letters to individual church buildings in different places. Like book of Ephesians was to a church building in Ephasus.
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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 19, 2018 20:45:30 GMT
What? You really want me to quote all of Timothy 1 right here? this is getting stupid. 1 Timothy is considered a pastoral epistle, they are addressed to individuals with pastoral oversight of churches and discuss issues of Christian living, doctrine, and leadership. These epistles are for church conduct. Yes, the conduct of the congregation (not a building) and the behavior of women regardless of whether or not they are married. Within the church building. Do you even know what a congregation is? It’s the act of assembling, where does the body assemble? In a church building facepalm this is just silly now
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 19, 2018 20:46:39 GMT
Did I just not quote a verse that calls it a building too? Or would you like more verses? It was addressed to a "church leader"...a person the head of a congregation. You did not quote any verse, and the blog does not equate the church to a building at all. Try again. Here's the link back to my quote with the verse in it just a few pages back. arktos.boards.net/post/29415
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:46:50 GMT
Scripture does call the church a group of people, not a building, as such: In the Bible the word church is a translation of the Greek word ekklesia , meaning “a calling out.” It never refers to a building or meeting place, but always to people, the ones “called out” of the world’s society by God calling them into His service. The Church of the Bible is not a cold, stone building, but a group of warm and loving people specially chosen by God.
The letter's as "greek" in origin explicitly state this...hence it is scriptural.
And don't back track on timothy, it is not about husband's and wives.....
You and Dk are literally forming your own interpretations....it is a cult nothing more. I dealt with them before with relatives.
cult n. A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader. Who’s our leader? Christ? this is ridiculous I agree, you trying to start a cult is ridiculous. It's people like you that cause various people to lose faith in God. The views you and Elizabeth take are extremist in the respect "only a small number" (both of you implied) are "sheep not goats" and will be saved. Such a small number is an extreme and by default you fall under the same judgement you accuses other's of. Elizabeth, but most specifically you, claim to be authorities in your own right and in these respect fall under an authoritarian form. It is by definition, your definition, a cult you are forming...I am only going off of the definition you apply.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:48:30 GMT
What? You really want me to quote all of Timothy 1 right here? this is getting stupid. 1 Timothy is considered a pastoral epistle, they are addressed to individuals with pastoral oversight of churches and discuss issues of Christian living, doctrine, and leadership. These epistles are for church conduct. I'm started to think he's just messing with us. I mean all of Paul's epistles are letters to individual church buildings in different places. Like book of Ephesians was to a church building in Ephasus. The original greek observes that church is not a building....this is a sola scriptura interpretation as the translation is strictly scriptural only...no room for interpretation. What so English is superior to the original translation?
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 19, 2018 20:51:18 GMT
I'm started to think he's just messing with us. I mean all of Paul's epistles are letters to individual church buildings in different places. Like book of Ephesians was to a church building in Ephasus. The original greek observes that church is not a building....this is a sola scriptura interpretation as the translation is strictly scriptural only...no room for interpretation. What so English is superior to the original translation? Let's do it easier. 1. Where do Catholics meet together? 2. What is that place: a building or a pineapple or a school bus or a dungeon or a lobster?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:51:19 GMT
It was addressed to a "church leader"...a person the head of a congregation. You did not quote any verse, and the blog does not equate the church to a building at all. Try again. Here's the link back to my quote with the verse in it just a few pages back. arktos.boards.net/post/29415This is why you must used scripture only. Ephesians 2 21.in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord. Church has 2 definitions. A building and the sheep. I cannot preach in the church but don't need to stay silent outside of it. As Paul said let them wait till later to speak but not in the church. Later means outside the building. The greek speaks for itself. Ephesians observes the metaphor of the holy temple
"Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. 21 In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. 22 And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit."
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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 19, 2018 20:52:18 GMT
cult n. A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader. Who’s our leader? Christ? this is ridiculous I agree, you trying to start a cult is ridiculous. It's people like you that cause various people to lose faith in God. The views you and Elizabeth take are extremist in the respect "only a small number" (both of you implied) are "sheep not goats" and will be saved. Such a small number is an extreme and by default you fall under the same judgement you accuses other's of. Elizabeth, but most specifically you, claim to be authorities in your own right and in these respect fall under an authoritarian form. It is by definition, your definition, a cult you are forming...I am only going off of the definition you apply. this is comedy
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Post by DKTrav88 on Jun 19, 2018 20:53:20 GMT
I'm started to think he's just messing with us. I mean all of Paul's epistles are letters to individual church buildings in different places. Like book of Ephesians was to a church building in Ephasus. The original greek observes that church is not a building....this is a sola scriptura interpretation as the translation is strictly scriptural only...no room for interpretation. What so English is superior to the original translation? Guess what, neither you or I are Greek scholars.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:53:24 GMT
The original greek observes that church is not a building....this is a sola scriptura interpretation as the translation is strictly scriptural only...no room for interpretation. What so English is superior to the original translation? Let's do it easier. 1. Where do Catholics meet together? With other Catholics2. What is that place: a building or a pineapple or a school bus or a dungeon or a lobster? With other Catholics and Christians...services are not in buildings all of the time. The church does not equal a building....and the greek, as I have said multiple times, does not reference a building. Don't ignore the Greek.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:54:14 GMT
I agree, you trying to start a cult is ridiculous. It's people like you that cause various people to lose faith in God. The views you and Elizabeth take are extremist in the respect "only a small number" (both of you implied) are "sheep not goats" and will be saved. Such a small number is an extreme and by default you fall under the same judgement you accuses other's of. Elizabeth, but most specifically you, claim to be authorities in your own right and in these respect fall under an authoritarian form. It is by definition, your definition, a cult you are forming...I am only going off of the definition you apply. this is comedy Considering you appear in more photos with her than your wife on this forum, and you preach "love"...yes it is a comedy.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 20:54:52 GMT
The original greek observes that church is not a building....this is a sola scriptura interpretation as the translation is strictly scriptural only...no room for interpretation. What so English is superior to the original translation? Guess what, neither you or I are Greek scholars. So the scholars are wrong and you are right?
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