|
Post by Elizabeth on May 21, 2018 4:56:24 GMT
Directions: If you agree with even one thing on the side of theologians then vote theologians. Only vote God if agree with everything on God's side and with nothing on theologians side. God | Theologians/People | God 1 and 2. You must continue in the learning of the Holy Scriptures because THEY are there to make you WISE for receiving salvation in your faith. It's all from God as the profitable doctrine for instruction to correct others and be complete for God. (2 Timothy 3:14-17) (God on authority/creed) Christians must have no authority over each other and live ONLY by Jesus' example in Scripture (Matthew 20:25-28, 1 Peter 2:21)
3. All sinned and fell short of God's glory (Romans 3:23) and only Christ is the example for us (1 Peter 2:21)
4. You're purified by Christ in obeying the truth in the Spirit and are born again (1 Peter 1:22, 23)
5. Fear Him for He can send you to hell (Matthew 10:28) | 1. A. The Scriptures and the Gospels, the Apostolic Church and the early Church Fathers, are the foundation. (Anglican theologians on authority) B. Bible, church fathers, popes, bishops; Seven Ecumenial Councils; Trent, Vatican, and other councils (Catholic theologians on authority) C. The Scriptures, both the Old and New Testaments, along with Sacred Apostolic Tradition. Plus seven Ecumenical Councils. (Orthodox theologians on authority) D. Standards of belief are to be found in the Bible and in the Church's historic Confession of Faith (Presbyterian theologians on authority)
2. A. The Three Creeds, Nicene Creed, Athanasius's Creed, and that which is commonly called the Apostles' Creed, ought thoroughly to be received and believed. (Angican theologians on creed) B. Special focus on Apostles' Creed and Nicene Creed (Catholics and Methodist theologians on creed) C. Scripture with Sacred Apostolic Tradition. Plus the seven Ecumenical Councils. (Orthodox theologians on creed) D. Scripture and in the Church's historic Confession of Faith. (Presbyterian theologians on creed)
3. A. Mary was sinless always (Catholic theologians on Mary) B. Regarded as a model for Christians (Presbyterian theologians on Mary)
4. All who die in God's grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified. after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven. (Catholic theologians on Purgatory)
5. Hell may or may not exist (Presbyterian theologians on hell)
|
Warnings: 1 Timothy 6:3-5 3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which accords with godliness, 4 he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and arguments over words, from which come envy, strife, reviling, evil suspicions, 5 useless wranglings of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself.2 Timothy 4:3-4 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. Matthew 15:9 9 And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men. Note: I was just informed that tapatalk users do not see the side by side chart. Best to look at the website since it mixes it up for you there. :/
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
|
Post by Deleted on May 24, 2018 23:51:14 GMT
The Hail Mary prayer isn’t in the Bible. It is in reference to "praying to people/saints" and "asking for prayers".And yes many English translations are different, I agree. Like the NIV for example removes verses, whole sections of verses, words, and changes words that have a different meaning. One example I like to use from the NIV is Acts 8:37, it’s been emitted from the NIV(as well as other bibles). Without going too much into this subject(because it is a very tiresome subject) I’ll point out that without verse 37, the whole point of baptism is complete removed from scripture, without it it says you don’t have to believe on Christ to be baptized, but that there is nothing to stop you from getting baptized if you want to get baptized. I find this troublesome, which is why I use the KJV. Most modern versions do things like I listed above, which takes away from the consistency in scripture and produces doubt in those who are searching for the truth. But I digress. So what verse in the bible would help in choosing the correct interpretation of scripture?
|
|
|
Post by Elizabeth on May 25, 2018 0:12:05 GMT
Hail Mary prayer is so retarded. Who made this idoltary up?
|
|
|
Post by DKTrav88 on May 25, 2018 0:12:10 GMT
The Hail Mary prayer isn’t in the Bible. It is in reference to "praying to people/saints" and "asking for prayers".And yes many English translations are different, I agree. Like the NIV for example removes verses, whole sections of verses, words, and changes words that have a different meaning. One example I like to use from the NIV is Acts 8:37, it’s been emitted from the NIV(as well as other bibles). Without going too much into this subject(because it is a very tiresome subject) I’ll point out that without verse 37, the whole point of baptism is complete removed from scripture, without it it says you don’t have to believe on Christ to be baptized, but that there is nothing to stop you from getting baptized if you want to get baptized. I find this troublesome, which is why I use the KJV. Most modern versions do things like I listed above, which takes away from the consistency in scripture and produces doubt in those who are searching for the truth. But I digress. So what verse in the bible would help in choosing the correct interpretation of scripture?It is in reference to "praying to people/saints" and "asking for prayers". So? The Hail Mary isn’t in scripture and neither does scripture say she nor any saint can make intercession for us. Only Christ can make intercession for saints. “So what verse in the bible would help in choosing the correct interpretation of scripture?” There isn’t one verse that would help in choosing the correct interpretation. You have to read it all and take it for what it says with the help of the Holy Spirit. Most of the Bible is quite literal. I can show you one example of a passage that is constantly misinterpreted; Genesis 6:1-4 KJV [1] And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, [2] That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. [3] And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. [4] There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. Many take this as saying fallen angels came and mated with women and created a race of giants, which is preposterous. Angels cannot reproduce; they do not have the same power as God as they cannot create. Some people will even go as far as saying the sons of God are extraterrestrials, also preposterous. They use “mighty men which were of old, men of renown” to justify their belief, but this belief requires a wild imagination and/or outside influence
|
|
|
Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 5:53:27 GMT
I will not say anything about the Catholic traditions ... but our Prayer for Mary is full of evangelical origin. According to the Gospels it is clear that Christ turned water into wine at the request of matter ... this story was not in vain entered the Scriptures. The Church of Heaven is the kingdom of heaven ... in Revelation it is clearly visible that the saints pray for our world! I'm sorry, but I clearly see your DKTrav88 Calvinist approach. Although you will deny this, but the approach that you adhere to is rooted in the French theologian Calvin ... although you will write that theologians are nothing to you, but in religion it does not happen. We see this clearly
|
|
|
Post by DKTrav88 on May 25, 2018 8:44:17 GMT
I will not say anything about the Catholic traditions ... but our Prayer for Mary is full of evangelical origin. According to the Gospels it is clear that Christ turned water into wine at the request of matter ... this story was not in vain entered the Scriptures. The Church of Heaven is the kingdom of heaven ... in Revelation it is clearly visible that the saints pray for our world! I'm sorry, but I clearly see your DKTrav88 Calvinist approach. Although you will deny this, but the approach that you adhere to is rooted in the French theologian Calvin ... although you will write that theologians are nothing to you, but in religion it does not happen. We see this clearly "our Prayer for Mary is full of evangelical origin." It's definitely not from scriptural origin. "in Revelation it is clearly visible that the saints pray for our world!" That is not what is said the verse you provided. Revelation 6:10 KJV [10] And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth They are asking God to execute judgment on the wicked during the end times, a time where there are no more righteous left in the world. This isn't an example of saints on earth praying to saints in heaven, much less saints in heaven making intercession for saints on earth. Moreover, scripture still clearly says Christ is the ONLY mediator between men and God. Nowhere in scripture does it say that saints can pray to other saints in heaven and those saints in heaven can then mediate or make intercession for saints on earth. It simply does not exist. "the approach that you adhere to is rooted in the French theologian Calvin" how. All I am doing is using scripture as an authority.
|
|
|
Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 9:29:28 GMT
Maybe these verses do not speak about this specifically, but this confirms the existence of the Heavenly Church! Heavenly church - praying for the earthly. About Mary, you did not understand my position here, so this is not the answer! Your approach to Scripture did not exist before Calvin, therefore from the perspective of not only religion, but history is purely Calvinistic-Puritan!
|
|
|
Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 9:35:47 GMT
Original sin is the sin of the first people. As a result, death came to man until Christ gave us the opportunity to live forever! My opinion is based on the Scriptures!
|
|
|
Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 9:40:30 GMT
From the history of Ukraine for example, we know that neo-Protestantism came here only in the era of liberalism. Our liberals have always been enemies of the Church and the Bible, but it was their business that opened up the road, I see that neo-proventants are now at the very nest of liberalism! Not surprised.
|
|
|
Post by DKTrav88 on May 25, 2018 9:44:40 GMT
Maybe these verses do not speak about this specifically, but this confirms the existence of the Heavenly Church! Heavenly church - praying for the earthly. About Mary, you did not understand my position here, so this is not the answer! Your approach to Scripture did not exist before Calvin, therefore from the perspective of not only religion, but history is purely Calvinistic-Puritan! There is a heavenly kingdom, Sion, heavenly Jerusalem. Scripture says there is. So you cannot admit that you are wrong about saints on earth being allowed to pray to saints in heaven who then mediate and make intercession for saints on earth? There is no scripture backing this, and yet you will not repent of this belief? Why do I need to wait for any clergy, and pope, scholar, or ecumenical council to explain the real meaning of any part of the Bible? Why can I not rely on the Holy Spirit? Why do I have to wait for a man to tell me what scripture says? Why can I not just take scripture for what it says and believe it?
|
|
|
Post by DKTrav88 on May 25, 2018 9:45:41 GMT
Original sin is the sin of the first people. As a result, death came to man until Christ gave us the opportunity to live forever! My opinion is based on the Scriptures! But Calvin believed it too, so you're a Calvinist.. I'm just using your logic against you here.
|
|
|
Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 9:47:35 GMT
He took it from the Catholics. It is necessary to have a critical approach
|
|
|
Post by DKTrav88 on May 25, 2018 9:47:58 GMT
From the history of Ukraine for example, we know that neo-Protestantism came here only in the era of liberalism. Our liberals have always been enemies of the Church and the Bible, but it was their business that opened up the road, I see that neo-proventants are now at the very nest of liberalism! Not surprised. How is this relevant? Are you accusing me of being politically liberal?
|
|
|
Post by DKTrav88 on May 25, 2018 9:48:30 GMT
He took it from the Catholics. It is necessary to have a critical approach Took what from the catholics? Infant baptism? Infant baptism isn't Biblical.
|
|
|
Post by Διαμονδ on May 25, 2018 10:04:28 GMT
No, of course, but it borders on this. Here, other people accuse you of liberalism! Life shows that it is people with Protestant views that have fallen into liberalism, but this is another story.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
|
Post by Deleted on May 25, 2018 15:49:01 GMT
Songs that Baptists sing at their meetings are mostly not from the Bible! I'm not talking about the Psalms! When Christians pray for each other, do they take the words for this from the Scripture 😧 22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the degree of the living God, to the heavenly Jerusalem and the darkness of the angels,
23 to the triumphant cathedral and the church of the first-borns written in heaven, and to the Judge of all God, and to the spirits of the righteous who have attained perfection,
(Heb. 12: 22,23) + Rev. 6: 10 There are a lot of songs that churches everywhere sing that are not from the Bible. Are you expecting me to condone of those Baptists who sing songs that aren’t from the Bible only because they’re Baptist? Also, how is this relevant to what I was asking? The bible is a source profitable for guidance, it is not the be all and end all of truth. Many aspects of Christianity exist from outside the bible and even biblical "truths" reflect pagan practices...hence a universality occurs. For example one method of determining if a woman was an adulterer was to have her right down a statement in ink on papyrus, wash it off in a basin of water, and if her statement of innocence was true she lived, if not she died. (I am going off of memory, it is in numbers or deuteronomy and the method may differ in a small degree). Egyptian priest practiced a similar method for memorization. Also the psalms replicated prayers made to Baal: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baal_Cycle. There is a list of other things, but I cannot recall at the moment what they are and will have to look them up again in a book I read (which was by a protestant). My point is that "scripture alone" inevitably leads to looking outside of scripture and a dual approach can be taken without contradiction.Hebrews 12:22-23 KJV [22] But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, [23] To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, Okay so this verse says nothing about saints praying to Christ in heaven for saints on earth or saints on earth praying to saints in heaven. Pick any "x" number of verses and they will not say anything about saints, praying, etc. That is the problem of a "no-authority" subjective sola-scriptura approach...it leads to relativistic chaos. We can see this increase in the "relationship with Jesus" occur culturally at about the same time the theory of relativity occuring, hence certain cultural universal coincide with certain movements in faith and knowledge.Revelation 6:10 KJV [10] And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? This verse also says nothing about saints praying for saints on earth. These are those saints in heaven who were slain for the word of God and for their testimony of our Lord. They are asking the Lord when He will judge the wicked on earth. There isn’t anything in this verse that says anything about saints in heaven praying to Christ for saints on earth or saints on earth praying to saints in heaven. I cannot tell if you are making a serious argument or not....Are you joking or am I misinterpreting you?
|
|