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Post by azulgerman on Dec 20, 2017 4:22:15 GMT
Hello, I live in Mexico, where there are a lot of inheritance of a lot of different "races"; I have noticed that the voice timber (not the tone) of people that are racially similar is kind of similar too... Am I the only one that have noticed that? And does anyone know if that has an explanation? Maybe the form of the place of articulation?
I'm new here, thanks.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Dec 20, 2017 9:55:02 GMT
Hello, I live in Mexico, where there are a lot of inheritance of a lot of different "races"; I have noticed that the voice timber (not the tone) of people that are racially similar is kind of similar too... Am I the only one that have noticed that? And does anyone know if that has an explanation? Maybe the form of the place of articulation? I'm new here, thanks. Just people with common roots live side by side and copy each other's voices! It starts with early childhood and is transmitted from parents and other close friends! |
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arPos
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Post by arPos on Dec 20, 2017 17:02:08 GMT
Yes vocal tracts are very evolution specific, thats also why the expectation that people just merge into a language is wrong,
And linguistics being the base of folk-identity ... well
I can expand and go into e.g. ebonics but I think you have the correct idea
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Post by azulgerman on Dec 28, 2017 21:50:42 GMT
thanks a lot for replying to my question. I will keep researching about that though !  |
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unorigional
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Post by unorigional on Dec 30, 2017 5:13:37 GMT
Yes vocal tracts are very evolution specific, thats also why the expectation that people just merge into a language is wrong, And linguistics being the base of folk-identity ... well I can expand and go into e.g. ebonics but I think you have the correct idea If there is anything biological... doubtful... it would be having the ability to hear and mimic the sounds. Much less about vocal tracts. Ebonics? I mean come on, that is just a case of a dialect. Try talking about languages that have genuine differences: English vs. say Mandarin Chinese. Speaking both, I can attest to the biggest barrier to learning Chinese from the perspective of a native English speaker is learning the tones. I began not being able to decipher them and now can't help but hear them and have a hard time using them wrong. But, had I started when I was younger, I'd be far better than I am even now. People merge into languages just fine, if they start when their mind is young enough to still develop the connections that enable native hearing and speaking. Folks that are older need to use a different part of the brain to learn a language. Diamond is right, the observation is a case of imitating the people that they were surrounded by. And yes, that should apply to timber as well. Mandarin may be an extreme example of it, but timber and tone are used to convey meaning in pretty much all languages. Try saying in English "Yeah, right." in a manner that suggests you agree with the person and then again if you were saying it sarcastically. You changed none of the words but the meaning comes across very clearly, to a native speaker, differently! It's all learned. |
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Post by joustos on May 11, 2018 20:28:06 GMT
Yes vocal tracts are very evolution specific, thats also why the expectation that people just merge into a language is wrong, And linguistics being the base of folk-identity ... well I can expand and go into e.g. ebonics but I think you have the correct idea If there is anything biological... doubtful... it would be having the ability to hear and mimic the sounds. Much less about vocal tracts. Ebonics? I mean come on, that is just a case of a dialect. Try talking about languages that have genuine differences: English vs. say Mandarin Chinese. Speaking both, I can attest to the biggest barrier to learning Chinese from the perspective of a native English speaker is learning the tones. I began not being able to decipher them and now can't help but hear them and have a hard time using them wrong. But, had I started when I was younger, I'd be far better than I am even now. People merge into languages just fine, if they start when their mind is young enough to still develop the connections that enable native hearing and speaking. Folks that are older need to use a different part of the brain to learn a language. Diamond is right, the observation is a case of imitating the people that they were surrounded by. And yes, that should apply to timber as well. Mandarin may be an extreme example of it, but timber and tone are used to convey meaning in pretty much all languages. Try saying in English "Yeah, right." in a manner that suggests you agree with the person and then again if you were saying it sarcastically. You changed none of the words but the meaning comes across very clearly, to a native speaker, differently! It's all learned. Fellows, it seems that you are confusing the pitch ["tone" of a Chinese sound] and the timbre [quality...] of a sound. Consider two English-speaking tenors who sing the same English song: one's voice is brilliant or crystalline; another's voice (on pitch!) is slightly veiled or makes veiled turns. Again, how do two Spanish speakers pronounce "cent"? One says something like "sent"; the other says something like "thent". The different timbres are due to the biological conditions of the vocal folds, but I don't know of studies made in these matters; I have simply observed various speakers or singers. A striking example: Two technically excellent singers of the same Italian operas: The British Joan Sutherland, and the Greek-American Maria Callas. Callas carries over the veiled quality of the Greek language to the Italian language. More accurately speaking, the biology of the Greek throat is responsible for both the quality of Greek speaking and of the speaking or singing in another language. So it seems. |
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