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Post by greatestiam on Sept 8, 2019 14:15:04 GMT
What do you think of the mainstream religions that are homophobic and misogynous?
I think they are stuck in the past and refuse to grow their moral sense to a higher level as they continue to discriminate and denigrate against gays and women without a just cause.
Should secular law do something against the religions that preach and teach poor morals and laws that are the opposite of the better secular law we live by?
We seem to be coming down on Islam and demanding they reform, but we seem to be ignoring Christianity’s efforts to make the world a worse place with homophobia and second class women.
Thoughts?
Regards DL
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 10:06:25 GMT
Clearly homosexuality is a sin in Christianity punishable by death . . .
You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. (Leviticus 18:22) If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13) And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. (Romans 1:27) Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. (Romans 1:32) Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Corinthians 6:9-10) The law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, men who practise homosexuality, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound doctrine. (1 Timothy. 1:9-10)
Yes, sin is punishable by death meaning hell which is called second death in bible. In OT killing them would be fine still but now we live by NT and we must wait until God sends them to hell. So now we help them or put up with them if they can't be helped. The Christian bible states that Jesus insists you follow the Old Testament as well as the New one. “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19 “It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17) “Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17) “Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 10:10:50 GMT
What do I care what the Golden Dawn necessitates? When you write "it is not traditional Christianity alone that has this anti homosexual behavior position" you are implying that I assume it is only Christianity. It obviously is not only Christianity. The Heralds of the Golden Dawn advocate "predatory spiritualism" as well as "vampirism" on their Facebook page...so your stance is different from the Hermetic Order in regards to religion? As to the other religions, I am not implying nor not implying anything, I am simply stating it is not Christianity alone...but that is a moot point. So you advocate vamprisism and predatory spiritualism and are against dominating the will of others? I am confused on your stance relative to how you view Christianity and other faiths in light of your self professed beliefs. I see where your confusion lies. The Herald of the Dawn has nothing to do with the Golden Dawn. You would need to understand what Predatory Spiritualism is in the Herald of the Dawn. There is no impedence of another's Will.
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 10:17:39 GMT
There is only one intelligent argument against homosexuality. Life began asexually. The primary basis of evolution is an adaptation that fosters the production and survival of offspring. production was more advantageous than asexual reproduction, as it allowed for greater genetic variation. Animals ultimately developed the ability to reproduce through the coming together of a male and female member of the species. Even though homosexuality is a perfectly fine and acceptable form of orientation it does go against the natural laws of species propagation. Other than stating the above, I personally do not have any bias towards same-sex relations or against women or the feminine principle. The primary basic of evolution is not survival of the offspring as the offspring must be eventually overwritten for better versions. There is no rational explanation for evolution as it does not explain why certain qualities of organisms never change. So evolution is really just an assumed stance for determining what is right and wrong behavior. We are left with isomorphic forms as the only rational validation for heterosexual behavior. The nature of the phallus and yanu are inversions of the other and necessitate a complimentary dualism. The phallus is projective in its form The yani is receptive in its absence of form (hollow). The phallus as projective reflects the dynamic state of the Male pscyhe. The yani as receptive reflects the passive state of the female psyche. The Male body is angular which reflects a rationality inherent within the dominant intellect of man as measuring reality through reason (math, logic, geometry) and precise definitions. The Female body is fluid in firm which reflects a more fluid emotional and intuitive state. The isomorphism of fluids its also interesting: The man projects white fluid from the groin that seeds or "creates" life, this comes from the more linear phallus and one hole. Man creates from bottom half with one hole. The woman projects white fluid from the chest that nourishes or maintains created life (child), this comes from the , which are curved rather than straight and two holes. Woman maintains with top half with two holes. Etc....the list can be continued later. Isomorphism, a universal law, necessitates the moral nature of heterosexuality and the anti moral behavior of homosexuality as it necessitates a inverse symmetry that when synthesized shows a fuller degree of unity in mental, physical and emotional states. In simpler terms, form determines morality and form is both constant and spatial in nature. I'm not familiar with the term Isomorphism, however, I'm not quite sure you are either . . . In biology, an isomorphism is a similarity of form or structure between organisms, generally between organisms with independent ancestries, e.g. after convergent evolution. Two organisms exhibiting isomorphism are referred to as isomorphs. The separate evolution of camera eyes in vertebrates and cephalopods (and insects, and many more, in as many as fifty separate instances), is an example of isomorphism. So is the evolution of wings in insects, pterosaurs, birds, and bats.
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Post by Elizabeth on Sept 9, 2019 14:47:59 GMT
Yes, sin is punishable by death meaning hell which is called second death in bible. In OT killing them would be fine still but now we live by NT and we must wait until God sends them to hell. So now we help them or put up with them if they can't be helped. The Christian bible states that Jesus insists you follow the Old Testament as well as the New one. “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19 “It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17) “Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17) “Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19) Incorrect. Jesus even stopped a killing Himself. As OT states adulterers must be killed. But Jesus saw the adultresses ready to be stoned and stopped it. Plus no where in the 10 commandments from OT/NT does it state to kill. If anything it says do not kill so yes Moses gave the law to not kill so we must uphold it Jesus said
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Post by xxxxxxxxx on Sept 9, 2019 16:44:48 GMT
The Heralds of the Golden Dawn advocate "predatory spiritualism" as well as "vampirism" on their Facebook page...so your stance is different from the Hermetic Order in regards to religion? As to the other religions, I am not implying nor not implying anything, I am simply stating it is not Christianity alone...but that is a moot point. So you advocate vamprisism and predatory spiritualism and are against dominating the will of others? I am confused on your stance relative to how you view Christianity and other faiths in light of your self professed beliefs. I see where your confusion lies. The Herald of the Dawn has nothing to do with the Golden Dawn. You would need to understand what Predatory Spiritualism is in the Herald of the Dawn. There is no impedence of another's Will.
Then what does the word "predatory" mean?
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Post by xxxxxxxxx on Sept 9, 2019 17:11:20 GMT
The primary basic of evolution is not survival of the offspring as the offspring must be eventually overwritten for better versions. There is no rational explanation for evolution as it does not explain why certain qualities of organisms never change. So evolution is really just an assumed stance for determining what is right and wrong behavior. We are left with isomorphic forms as the only rational validation for heterosexual behavior. The nature of the phallus and yanu are inversions of the other and necessitate a complimentary dualism. The phallus is projective in its form The yani is receptive in its absence of form (hollow). The phallus as projective reflects the dynamic state of the Male pscyhe. The yani as receptive reflects the passive state of the female psyche. The Male body is angular which reflects a rationality inherent within the dominant intellect of man as measuring reality through reason (math, logic, geometry) and precise definitions. The Female body is fluid in firm which reflects a more fluid emotional and intuitive state. The isomorphism of fluids its also interesting: The man projects white fluid from the groin that seeds or "creates" life, this comes from the more linear phallus and one hole. Man creates from bottom half with one hole. The woman projects white fluid from the chest that nourishes or maintains created life (child), this comes from the , which are curved rather than straight and two holes. Woman maintains with top half with two holes. Etc....the list can be continued later. Isomorphism, a universal law, necessitates the moral nature of heterosexuality and the anti moral behavior of homosexuality as it necessitates a inverse symmetry that when synthesized shows a fuller degree of unity in mental, physical and emotional states. In simpler terms, form determines morality and form is both constant and spatial in nature. I'm not familiar with the term Isomorphism, however, I'm not quite sure you are either . . . In biology, an isomorphism is a similarity of form or structure between organisms, generally between organisms with independent ancestries, e.g. after convergent evolution. Two organisms exhibiting isomorphism are referred to as isomorphs. The separate evolution of camera eyes in vertebrates and cephalopods (and insects, and many more, in as many as fifty separate instances), is an example of isomorphism. So is the evolution of wings in insects, pterosaurs, birds, and bats. In math it is a morphism that can be invested into a symmetrical similar stance, with the general definition of "isomorphism" being "corresponding or similar characteristics. The vertebrate and cephalopod have isomorphic properties as well considering they share many inverse characterisitics: Vertebrates interior bone structure with bone structure being hollow. Cephalopods and exterior "bone" structure or rather "shell" which mimics that of the bone structure of vertebrates as essentially hollow. Vertebrates interior and cephalopods exterior. The eye structures share a base isomorphism as well. Vertebrate single moving "lens" (poor word), cephalopod many unmoving lens. Vertebrates interal gestation, cephalopods external gestation...etc. That isomorphism, or inversive symmetry sets a foundation for morality as well as the negative anti symmetrical attributes of homosexuality.
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Post by thesageofmainstreet on Sept 9, 2019 18:39:05 GMT
What do you mean by homophobic? Because relgions that say homophobia is sin and stuff are not actually homophobic. They will not harm them or anything but will just disagree with their ways of life. This is my religion. The other relgions will physically cause harm to them. This is homophobia in action. Clearly homosexuality is a sin in Christianity punishable by death . . .
You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. (Leviticus 18:22) If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)
And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. (Romans 1:27)
Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. (Romans 1:32)
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Corinthians 6:9-10)
The law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, men who practise homosexuality, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound doctrine. (1 Timothy. 1:9-10)
Peter Pan ComplexFrom the way the story of Sodom is told, homosexuality itself is part of the punishment. In secular terms, those who are afraid to grow up choose that miserable, addictive, and obsessive lifestyle as a way to escape reality by reverting to childishness.
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 21:13:52 GMT
I see where your confusion lies. The Herald of the Dawn has nothing to do with the Golden Dawn. You would need to understand what Predatory Spiritualism is in the Herald of the Dawn. There is no impedence of another's Will.
Then what does the word "predatory" mean? You can't look up the word 'predatory'? The term Predatory Spiritualism in the Herald of the Dawn is a practice based on the meditation and visualization of archetypal structures, the devouring of their Vital Essence along with Neurotheology and particularly Neuroplasticity. A simplistic yet accurate term for the process involved would be ‘Majiqal Thinking’. Objective change is created by first creating subjective change within one’s being through various practices of meditation and ritual. . . . you're trying too hard
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 21:18:43 GMT
The Christian bible states that Jesus insists you follow the Old Testament as well as the New one. “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19 “It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17) “Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17) “Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19) Incorrect. Jesus even stopped a killing Himself. As OT states adulterers must be killed. But Jesus saw the adultresses ready to be stoned and stopped it. Plus no where in the 10 commandments from OT/NT does it state to kill. If anything it says do not kill so yes Moses gave the law to not kill so we must uphold it Jesus said You must be kidding . . . 1 Chronicles 21 -God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people
Deuteronomy 3 -God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. -He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value
Joshua 6 -He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” -In (Judges 21) He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead
2 Kings 10:18-27 God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church!
Judges 21:10-24 God has an entire town killed and the virgins repeatedly raped, and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more.
Numbers 31:7-18 "They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men . . . Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.
Deuteronomy 20:10-14 "As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you."
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 "When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house . . . After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife."
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Post by xxxxxxxxx on Sept 9, 2019 21:28:12 GMT
Then what does the word "predatory" mean? You can't look up the word 'predatory'? The term Predatory Spiritualism in the Herald of the Dawn is a practice based on the meditation and visualization of archetypal structures, the devouring of their Vital Essence along with Neurotheology and particularly Neuroplasticity. A simplistic yet accurate term for the process involved would be ‘Majiqal Thinking’. Objective change is created by first creating subjective change within one’s being through various practices of meditation and ritual. . . . you're trying too hard
2. "seeking to exploit or oppress others."
So explain how you reconcile this when the visualization of archetypal structures requires empirical experiences, ie "relations" with people, that require "domination"?
You seem divided...like you are cannibalizing yourself.
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 21:36:09 GMT
You can't look up the word 'predatory'? The term Predatory Spiritualism in the Herald of the Dawn is a practice based on the meditation and visualization of archetypal structures, the devouring of their Vital Essence along with Neurotheology and particularly Neuroplasticity. A simplistic yet accurate term for the process involved would be ‘Majiqal Thinking’. Objective change is created by first creating subjective change within one’s being through various practices of meditation and ritual. . . . you're trying too hard
2. "seeking to exploit or oppress others."
So explain how you reconcile this when the visualization of archetypal structures requires empirical experiences, ie "relations" with people, that require "domination"?
You seem divided...like you are cannibalizing yourself.
How does visualization of archetypal structures include dominating people (humans)? You continue to sound confused . . .
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Post by Elizabeth on Sept 9, 2019 21:40:26 GMT
Incorrect. Jesus even stopped a killing Himself. As OT states adulterers must be killed. But Jesus saw the adultresses ready to be stoned and stopped it. Plus no where in the 10 commandments from OT/NT does it state to kill. If anything it says do not kill so yes Moses gave the law to not kill so we must uphold it Jesus said You must be kidding . . . 1 Chronicles 21 -God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people
Deuteronomy 3 -God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. -He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value
Joshua 6 -He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” -In (Judges 21) He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead
2 Kings 10:18-27 God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church!
Judges 21:10-24 God has an entire town killed and the virgins repeatedly raped, and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more.
Numbers 31:7-18 "They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men . . . Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.
Deuteronomy 20:10-14 "As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you."
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 "When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house . . . After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife."
Once again..you have quoted OT. Jesus removed that stuff. And only God creates and takes away life. This was always true. Except in OT God gave His people permission at times to do it for Him. Now that position was taken away because it was misused. NT is no killing by humans allowed at all and reserved for God only.
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Etu Malku
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Post by Etu Malku on Sept 9, 2019 21:51:48 GMT
You must be kidding . . . 1 Chronicles 21 -God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people
Deuteronomy 3 -God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. -He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value
Joshua 6 -He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” -In (Judges 21) He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead
2 Kings 10:18-27 God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church!
Judges 21:10-24 God has an entire town killed and the virgins repeatedly raped, and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more.
Numbers 31:7-18 "They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men . . . Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.
Deuteronomy 20:10-14 "As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you."
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 "When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house . . . After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife."
Once again..you have quoted OT. Jesus removed that stuff. And only God creates and takes away life. This was always true. Except in OT God gave His people permission at times to do it for Him. Now that position was taken away because it was misused. NT is no killing by humans allowed at all and reserved for God only. Did you forget all the NT quotes I posted stating that Jesus insisted 'everything' from the OT is to be followed to the letter? My conclusion based on the scriptures of all the Abrahamic faiths, is that they are inherently evil and backwards to human spirituality. Of course that is simply my opinion. Not to mention, the god of the OT is the same god of the NT . . . a pre-Canaanite war deity.
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Post by xxxxxxxxx on Sept 9, 2019 21:53:34 GMT
2. "seeking to exploit or oppress others."
So explain how you reconcile this when the visualization of archetypal structures requires empirical experiences, ie "relations" with people, that require "domination"?
You seem divided...like you are cannibalizing yourself.
How does visualization of archetypal structures include dominating people (humans)? You continue to sound confused . . .
Because these archetypes observe how we relate to all phenomenon (people included) around us. The are qualifications, through symbols, of the inherent manner we not just percieve reality but ourselves, we move through how we percieve.
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Post by xxxxxxxxx on Sept 9, 2019 21:57:04 GMT
2. "seeking to exploit or oppress others."
So explain how you reconcile this when the visualization of archetypal structures requires empirical experiences, ie "relations" with people, that require "domination"?
You seem divided...like you are cannibalizing yourself.
How does visualization of archetypal structures include dominating people (humans)? You continue to sound confused . . .
Many archetypal structures are anthropomorphic in nature, as we relate to these structures as embodiments of ourselves and others...you continue to sound confused on what an archetype is...it is a symbolic image of how we mediate reality, thus it is a form of how we relate to other's and ourselves.
A predatory approach to the archetypes, as symbols of our relations, is a predatory approach to relationships which are mediated through that archetype...you really don't read much of Jung do you?
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