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Post by Eugene 2.0 on Jun 7, 2019 19:06:44 GMT
We know that Christ is the son of God, but what about the rest of us? Are we God's children?
In Mathews, among the other commandments of bliss, we read: "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called children of God" (5:9, NIV). In John's writings there's a text: "...Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed" (8:34-36 NIV).
I don't be so sure about derivation "we're children of God" from those text places in Gospels. However, I continue to think that all the people are children of God in some sense. He's the creator of everything, including an act of birth. Well, if Jesus is His son, why should it not concern us all?
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Post by cynicsanonymous on Jun 17, 2019 2:57:55 GMT
Then if you end up in hell for believing that you understand it won't be anyone else's fault but your own right? Just like the lady was at fault in the example you proposed since neither of you wished to seek anything but the current life. queen! if god created everything, everything is his fault. the good and the bad, but there are too many fucked up things for him to be a perfect all benevolent being.
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 17, 2019 5:24:53 GMT
Then if you end up in hell for believing that you understand it won't be anyone else's fault but your own right? Just like the lady was at fault in the example you proposed since neither of you wished to seek anything but the current life. queen! if god created everything, everything is his fault. the good and the bad, but there are too many fucked up things for him to be a perfect all benevolent being. That logic wouldn't work even in court. The murderer can't say, "My parents created me. Everything I do is their fault." He'd probably be told to grow up and might get a mental evaluation because everyone is responsible for their own actions.
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Post by Eugene 2.0 on Jun 17, 2019 17:48:58 GMT
All right. What do you propose to him? To create another paradise where people would be like sheep? i dont propose anything, i m just pointing out the ridiculous narrative of an almighty God playing judge. Yes, I agree that archetype of almighty God is not so shining today, but it doesn't mean it's bad comparing to science. I don't believe human they are less trusty, than even non-existent God. Without God we'll be nothing. "Without God everything is permissible" said Dostoevsky, and he was right as well as Kant who said something like that before mentioning that every people did need in God. But why? Why is it impossible to act without God? - Maybe you're right, and there's no God. And what? What's next? What people should do? - To run like hell being some outrageous ones robbing stores, and deflowering misses? We can't build anything decent without God, because He is a symbol of this decency, and people are needed in that decency. When the artificial intelligence has been created, when we are be able to go to the other planets far out of our solar system, what moral principle we have to take? What political system should we take? - The best one, isn't it? But the symbol of any such perfect systems is a system of gods. God is our projection too. And because God lives, nevertheless he's dead or alive, in every epoch and in every culture, it must ring a bell that in some way He exists.
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Post by cynicsanonymous on Jun 17, 2019 18:44:32 GMT
i dont propose anything, i m just pointing out the ridiculous narrative of an almighty God playing judge. Yes, I agree that archetype of almighty God is not so shining today, but it doesn't mean it's bad comparing to science. I don't believe human they are less trusty, than even non-existent God. Without God we'll be nothing. "Without God everything is permissible" said Dostoevsky, and he was right as well as Kant who said something like that before mentioning that every people did need in God. But why? Why is it impossible to act without God? - Maybe you're right, and there's no God. And what? What's next? What people should do? - To run like hell being some outrageous ones robbing stores, and deflowering misses? We can't build anything decent without God, because He is a symbol of this decency, and people are needed in that decency. When the artificial intelligence has been created, when we are be able to go to the other planets far out of our solar system, what moral principle we have to take? What political system should we take? - The best one, isn't it? But the symbol of any such perfect systems is a system of gods. God is our projection too. And because God lives, nevertheless he's dead or alive, in every epoch and in every culture, it must ring a bell that in some way He exists. God is the evilest fictitious character. He sends people to burn for eternity, he killed innocent children in Egypt, he turned an innocent woman into salt, he murdered all humanity with a flood, he commands you to put homosexuals to death, he commands you to put adulterers to death, he commands you to put to death whoever doesn't respect the Sabbath, he believes in human sacrifices and archaic ideas. we don't need god to survive, people knew what was good and wrong way before god by evolutionary trades, that is called empathy and its a fundamental piece of living in a society, so you are trying to tell me that if people didn't believe in God they would just go out and rape and kill? I don't think so, people have a natural tendency for chaos, but I bet they are way more scared of human law enforcement than a God. If you saw proof that there is no god would you start killing people?
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Post by Eugene 2.0 on Jun 17, 2019 19:46:41 GMT
Yes, I agree that archetype of almighty God is not so shining today, but it doesn't mean it's bad comparing to science. I don't believe human they are less trusty, than even non-existent God. Without God we'll be nothing. "Without God everything is permissible" said Dostoevsky, and he was right as well as Kant who said something like that before mentioning that every people did need in God. But why? Why is it impossible to act without God? - Maybe you're right, and there's no God. And what? What's next? What people should do? - To run like hell being some outrageous ones robbing stores, and deflowering misses? We can't build anything decent without God, because He is a symbol of this decency, and people are needed in that decency. When the artificial intelligence has been created, when we are be able to go to the other planets far out of our solar system, what moral principle we have to take? What political system should we take? - The best one, isn't it? But the symbol of any such perfect systems is a system of gods. God is our projection too. And because God lives, nevertheless he's dead or alive, in every epoch and in every culture, it must ring a bell that in some way He exists. God is the evilest fictitious character. He sends people to burn for eternity, he killed innocent children in Egypt, he turned an innocent woman into salt, he murdered all humanity with a flood, he commands you to put homosexuals to death, he commands you to put adulterers to death, he commands you to put to death whoever doesn't respect the Sabbath, he believes in human sacrifices and archaic ideas. we don't need god to survive, people knew what was good and wrong way before god by evolutionary trades, that is called empathy and its a fundamental piece of living in a society, so you are trying to tell me that if people didn't believe in God they would just go out and rape and kill? I don't think so, people have a natural tendency for chaos, but I bet they are way more scared of human law enforcement than a God. If you saw proof that there is no god would you start killing people? I don't think you're right accusing God in everything... For me, 'to looking for something good' implies 'to believe in God', not vice versa. There is no gods or moral commands for anyone who's plotting something worse and evil. I don't know what would I do if God gave me an order to kill my sister, for example. There are lots of that nightmare in Old Testament, and I know it. I'm not so stupid to think that the ten commandments can be a good barrier for crime. I believe in free will, not in that Bible is a thing that stops crime by itself. No, Bible is a tool, just like the logic. It's obvious for me that statistically many believers are more rage and cruel than atheists, but why this must show me that atheistic society is right in its moral choice? Any human consists at least two sides - his own (personal), and an animal one (as Locke taught; I would say that it is close to what Freud talked later). Our animal side is still there, and I think that this side is hard to calm down. What am I looking for? I would like to see friendship between atheists and theists. If it would be possible it would prove me that people weren't just animals. Maybe this is a case that we just can't understand each other even if we're all native language speakers.
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Post by greatestiam on Jun 18, 2019 18:47:32 GMT
Scriptures say that god created all things for his pleasure. An obvious assumption.
Tell us what pleasure god gets from his creating Satan and giving her extra powers to deceive us all.
Regards DL
You mean why did God create angels? For them to help Him out and live. Living things like to live. Why do living things turn evil like an angel turned to be evil? Because some living things want to be stupid and get punished. Your god knew what Satan would become yet went ahead and created her anyway. Thanks for your low I.Q. response. People like you are great for my side. Regards DL
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Post by greatestiam on Jun 18, 2019 19:13:08 GMT
so the woman that loves her family and pays her bills on time and its an overall human being that hasn't killed anyone but does not believe in god ... does she deserve to burn in hell for ever? dont tell me that we send ourselves to hell, because that is note true , besides god created hell, and if that is not enough, he is omnipotent and can forgive you or destroy hell and evil if he wanted to.. so, just to make it clear, whoever sends you to eternal fire, or even lets you burn for eternity being able to stop you from such suffering, is a monster. That woman didn't seek to be saved so yes she goes to hell because she obviously didn't want to go to heaven. God cannot force her to go where she didn't seek to go. He's not evil.
Yet he will force her to go to hell.
If you cannot refute what follows, then he is quite evil, which matches his genocidal son murdering ways.
The bottom line on the existence of hell would be the moral implications. God killing instead of curing is evil. God curing instead of killing is good. If gods do the good, then there is no hell. Such logic trails are how god’s attributes are found in many areas of thought.
Regards DL
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Post by greatestiam on Jun 18, 2019 19:16:14 GMT
that is scary Elizabeth. No one, absolutely no one, not Hitler, not Jack the Ripper, not a guy who kills children and rape their corpses, not even that... deserves eternal suffering. the suffering describes in hell, is disproportionate for any sin. And if God lets a regular woman receive such punishment, that makes him a monster. Disproportionate punishment is, cracking the skull open and chopping the dick off a guy who robbed your house. that would make you worse than the criminal, that is what God does. You seem to suffer immoral fools better than I. Good for you, given the poor apologetics that you and I have to deal with. I gave a link just above that you may not have seen.
Regards DL
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 18, 2019 19:52:06 GMT
You mean why did God create angels? For them to help Him out and live. Living things like to live. Why do living things turn evil like an angel turned to be evil? Because some living things want to be stupid and get punished. Your god knew what Satan would become yet went ahead and created her anyway. Thanks for your low I.Q. response. People like you are great for my side. Regards DL
God created you to be good like He created His angels to be good to Him. But just because He knew you'd refuse Him doesn't mean He didn't need you anyway. You still serve His purpose. Satan still served His purpose for sometime. When God is through He will dispose of such in hell. My IQ is quite high but not nearly as brilliant as God's IQ. But at least He shares it with me so I can gain knowledge constantly! So I'm overjoyed to be learning from Him
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 18, 2019 19:53:07 GMT
You mean why did God create angels? For them to help Him out and live. Living things like to live. Why do living things turn evil like an angel turned to be evil? Because some living things want to be stupid and get punished. Your god knew what Satan would become yet went ahead and created her anyway. Thanks for your low I.Q. response. People like you are great for my side. Regards DL
Satan isn't a her either. Whata....
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 18, 2019 19:56:07 GMT
That woman didn't seek to be saved so yes she goes to hell because she obviously didn't want to go to heaven. God cannot force her to go where she didn't seek to go. He's not evil.
Yet he will force her to go to hell.
If you cannot refute what follows, then he is quite evil, which matches his genocidal son murdering ways.
The bottom line on the existence of hell would be the moral implications. God killing instead of curing is evil. God curing instead of killing is good. If gods do the good, then there is no hell. Such logic trails are how god’s attributes are found in many areas of thought.
Regards DL
She chose hell. God doesn't force. He gives. Like I'm choosing heaven and will get that. You aren't choosing heaven so God won't need to force hell. Everything comes naturally. God never killed anything. He crosses people over. So if He removed someone by death here it meant He crossed them over to eternal LIFE. You are never dead as in none existent.
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Post by greatestiam on Jun 18, 2019 20:22:54 GMT
Your god knew what Satan would become yet went ahead and created her anyway. Thanks for your low I.Q. response. People like you are great for my side. Regards DL
Satan isn't a her either. Whata.... Have you never viewed the expulsion painting in the Vatican collection?
No wonder your own religion tells you to sit down and shut up in church, even with your high I.Q. that has you being so stupid and doing Satan's work and helping my side with your crap apologetics.
Regards DL
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Post by Elizabeth on Jun 18, 2019 22:36:57 GMT
Satan isn't a her either. Whata.... Have you never viewed the expulsion painting in the Vatican collection?
No wonder your own religion tells you to sit down and shut up in church, even with your high I.Q. that has you being so stupid and doing Satan's work and helping my side with your crap apologetics.
Regards DL
The Vatican? My religion? Dude that's Satanic. Never tie me to the Vatican church of Satan. I only follow God in yhe Scripture and Scripture says Satan is a male, or spirit more preferrably. And I don't talk in church. I only do my preaching outside lf it. Men are called to work more than me in church so I need my vacation.
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Post by greatestiam on Jun 18, 2019 23:36:39 GMT
What you need is a brain. But thanks for doing such good work for my side. Regards DL
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