technoworld
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Tears for fears
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Post by technoworld on Jul 7, 2018 6:59:47 GMT
why is it popular
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2018 13:08:48 GMT
Exactly, it is people in power, who influence the system, based on their whims and fancies. The systems have been designed to be perfect, but the people in power forget that they are there to maintain this perfection. I think, power makes a person megalomaniac, if they don't take responsibility I think megalomania is a result of over-weening. The power-monger seeks power as a consequence of being breast-fed for too long as an infant. When he realizes that power will not satisfy the subconscious urges, he starts to vent anger, which can win him more unsatisfying power; the vicious cycle ensues. The egotist's personality is nearly always fixated on psycho- demands. There is also the opposite personality too, which is cold detached egotism, but that normally results in the dis-organised psychopathic loner/killer. It had much to do with those first 6 years of personality development; but we must not reduce to this either. Past lives also have their super-sub-conscious effect; karma. Glad to know, that you also reckon the karmic influence of one's life, this, previous and how it would be effected. Are not communists negation of this philosophy, because, as far as I know, they believe in existentialist, and the selfish goals must be pursued, at any cost, is their teachings. Why is that all such new age,modern philosophies are not able to give an individual proper guidance to lead their own life better?
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Post by jonbain on Aug 4, 2018 13:29:24 GMT
Its vital to see that totalitarianism can be communist or capitalist, and that a free market, whilst traditionally is said to carry the label 'capitalism' is quite different from monopolist capitalism. And any type of government is only superficially an economic model, the real power of monopolists lies in taking control of the legal process; which itself is subject to policing. So an ideal state would actually be a free-market based on communism which is somewhat like China. Now China is hardly in poverty. Nationalism had reduced it to the poorest in the world by 1930-1950, and semi-communism has made it the equal to America, which itself has been stagnating for 50 years. So it really comes down to individuals deliberately dismantling the monopolist mindset. You say China was reduced by nationalists to poorest in the world which is total lie. Chinese economy was way worse during last years of Qing dynasty. Also you can blame japanese for totally destroying most of chinese industry during 2nd sino-japanese war (1937-1945) which led to breakdown after ww2. knoema.com/mpeqfkc/gdp-levels-and-per-capita-gdp-for-china-japan-and-south-korea This clearly shows china was indeed better off during first year of communist rule(economy inherited from nationalist china post ww2) than during Qing dynasty(year 1900 and 1913 two years after revolution) And here is graph that clearly shows chinese GDP started to get higher very quickly after privatization of farms which is indeed big diversion from communism. It got even higher when chinese economy started to get more open. Same graph(link) also shows that japanese nationalist goverment transformed japan from feudal country to strongest asian nation with strongest industry in several decades. Firstly a 'lie' is when someone is being deliberately false; with intent to deceive and harm the other. If one is misinformed, then this is not due to deliberate sinister 'lies'; but to understandable errors either in thinking or perceiving or teaching. Secondly, your graph shows zero benefit from Nationalist China, and is not detailed enough for a comparison to previous governments/dynasties. As it is, after ww2 Mao inherited the worst infant mortality rate ever recorded. And he turned it into one of the fastest growing economies ever heard of. As for Japan's role; it was somewhat inevitable. The Chinese Nat, Kai-shek committed the worst atrocity I have ever heard of when he flooded the Japanese army killing 100 000; at the same time murdering a million or more of his own people. That alone speaks volumes for the Nationalist mindset. China's death-rate during ww2 cannot be agreed upon to an error of better than 100%. Again, this occurred under the Nationalist govt. Eventually they were booted out to Taiwan, and during apartheid, Taiwan was the Afrikaner government's only 'ally'. You claim wonders on the part of the Japanese Nats, and then blame them for China's problems? This is because you measure success via money, I measure it in this example with infant mortality. Japan running rampant in Asia is well-described in the widely printed book: Total War: The Story of World War II (1972 ) by Peter Calvocoressi and Guy Wint. Essentially the Japanese army: the Kwantung, detached itself from Japan and became a force and entity on its own. So it had little to do with government, more a lack of government. This was after the Kwantung were used as a police-force in Manchuria, quite legitimately, due to Japan having the contract to build a railway there. Manchuria was a backwater, which was effectively run by lawless brigands. It may have been better had it become its own state. But all these problems were caused by overpopulation, and resolved by less overpopulation. Incidentally over-population is the essential 20th century tool of the Nationalist who aims to overpower his neighbors with sheer numbers of people. It is essentially neo-feudal. That is, Nationalism is just feudalism on a Nation-scale. Much like the neo-fascist corporate entities of today are just trans-national neo-feudal. Instead of over-population, their tool is over-monetization, which attempts to reduce all human activity to pennies and pounds. You typically fall under their brainwashing techniques by evaluating quality of life with GDP, rather than seeing quality as something entirely different to quantity. Selah!
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Post by jonbain on Aug 4, 2018 13:35:15 GMT
I think megalomania is a result of over-weening. The power-monger seeks power as a consequence of being breast-fed for too long as an infant. When he realizes that power will not satisfy the subconscious urges, he starts to vent anger, which can win him more unsatisfying power; the vicious cycle ensues. The egotist's personality is nearly always fixated on psycho- demands. There is also the opposite personality too, which is cold detached egotism, but that normally results in the dis-organised psychopathic loner/killer. It had much to do with those first 6 years of personality development; but we must not reduce to this either. Past lives also have their super-sub-conscious effect; karma. Glad to know, that you also reckon the karmic influence of one's life, this, previous and how it would be effected. Are not communists negation of this philosophy, because, as far as I know, they believe in existentialist, and the selfish goals must be pursued, at any cost, is their teachings. Why is that all such new age,modern philosophies are not able to give an individual proper guidance to lead their own life better? Yes, the big error in communism is to reduce equality to a merely material state. The problem in modern philosophy is essentially a result of Saxon culture which tries to reduce all human behavior to the monetary system. Then they see themselves as being in control of all people. As I said earlier, its actually a result mostly of child-rearing practices. The feminists tell us that 'the hand the rocks the cradle rules the world'. Perhaps they should rock the cradle a little more gently sometimes.
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Onetrack
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Post by Onetrack on Aug 4, 2018 15:13:12 GMT
I thought it was socialism that everyone on the left was wanting so badly, without knowing anything about it, except è the 6-year-olds fantasy utopia " That could never possibly work - I'll just refer to this as the star trek future vision from now on. It's also hilarious that anti-fascism is done by the fascists themselves.. dressed all in black, faces covered, nails in bats and pop cans full of cement looking for a fight for what they believe is right, while bludgeoning people to prevent free speech and burning cars, destroying businesses etc.
But that's another story...
I think what the left is in love with but awfully confused about is socialism vs a socialized benefits system (like we have here in Canada) everyone pays a little, and those who need it for medical, dental and welfare benefits can withdraw from the pot. This only works if money is going in, and what a lot of people simply cannot understand is that if nothing goes in, the well runs dry and those benefits evaporate as well.
The left is in love with socialism, including the never-Trumper far left and the panty-fa movement who are always in a bunch, but I don't see them vacationing in Venezuela.
Preach Preach Preach, just never practice it.
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czechpatriarch
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Post by czechpatriarch on Aug 4, 2018 18:24:40 GMT
You say China was reduced by nationalists to poorest in the world which is total lie. Chinese economy was way worse during last years of Qing dynasty. Also you can blame japanese for totally destroying most of chinese industry during 2nd sino-japanese war (1937-1945) which led to breakdown after ww2. knoema.com/mpeqfkc/gdp-levels-and-per-capita-gdp-for-china-japan-and-south-korea This clearly shows china was indeed better off during first year of communist rule(economy inherited from nationalist china post ww2) than during Qing dynasty(year 1900 and 1913 two years after revolution) And here is graph that clearly shows chinese GDP started to get higher very quickly after privatization of farms which is indeed big diversion from communism. It got even higher when chinese economy started to get more open. Same graph(link) also shows that japanese nationalist goverment transformed japan from feudal country to strongest asian nation with strongest industry in several decades. Firstly a 'lie' is when someone is being deliberately false; with intent to deceive and harm the other. If one is misinformed, then this is not due to deliberate sinister 'lies'; but to understandable errors either in thinking or perceiving or teaching. Secondly, your graph shows zero benefit from Nationalist China, and is not detailed enough for a comparison to previous governments/dynasties. As it is, after ww2 Mao inherited the worst infant mortality rate ever recorded. And he turned it into one of the fastest growing economies ever heard of. As for Japan's role; it was somewhat inevitable. The Chinese Nat, Kai-shek committed the worst atrocity I have ever heard of when he flooded the Japanese army killing 100 000; at the same time murdering a million or more of his own people. That alone speaks volumes for the Nationalist mindset. China's death-rate during ww2 cannot be agreed upon to an error of better than 100%. Again, this occurred under the Nationalist govt. Eventually they were booted out to Taiwan, and during apartheid, Taiwan was the Afrikaner government's only 'ally'. You claim wonders on the part of the Japanese Nats, and then blame them for China's problems? This is because you measure success via money, I measure it in this example with infant mortality. Japan running rampant in Asia is well-described in the widely printed book: Total War: The Story of World War II (1972 ) by Peter Calvocoressi and Guy Wint. Essentially the Japanese army: the Kwantung, detached itself from Japan and became a force and entity on its own. So it had little to do with government, more a lack of government. This was after the Kwantung were used as a police-force in Manchuria, quite legitimately, due to Japan having the contract to build a railway there. Manchuria was a backwater, which was effectively run by lawless brigands. It may have been better had it become its own state. But all these problems were caused by overpopulation, and resolved by less overpopulation. Incidentally over-population is the essential 20th century tool of the Nationalist who aims to overpower his neighbors with sheer numbers of people. It is essentially neo-feudal. That is, Nationalism is just feudalism on a Nation-scale. Much like the neo-fascist corporate entities of today are just trans-national neo-feudal. Instead of over-population, their tool is over-monetization, which attempts to reduce all human activity to pennies and pounds. You typically fall under their brainwashing techniques by evaluating quality of life with GDP, rather than seeing quality as something entirely different to quantity. Selah! Chinese economy started to rise after Mao´s death www.new-normal.com/economic-growth/dengs-economic-policy-in-chinas-post-mao-period/again large constant decreasing of poverty after enactment of economic policies of 1978 geopoliticalfutures.com/china-is-still-really-poor/Chiang-kai-shek killed milion of his own people. Well compared to Mao www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/books/news/maos-great-leap-forward-killed-45-million-in-four-years-2081630.html also dont forget cultural revolution Yes i blame japan for destroying part of chinese industry not for all its problems. Does that mean i cant point out their success? Sounds stupid. You claim nationalism is neo feudalism first learn what feudalism is. " feudalism was a system in which people were given land and protection by people of higher rank, and worked and fought for them in return." this is neo feudalism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-feudalism. I don´t measure nations success only on economic basis but economy is important when measuring nation´s success.
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Ace
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Post by Ace on Aug 5, 2018 1:17:37 GMT
Communism is popular because it appeals to a six year old's dream of a Utopia where there's no government, no money, nobody is better than anyone else (no classes), and everybody owns everything together, everyone gets everything for free, and everybody gets along and helps one another and is one big happy family. Unfortunately the world doesn't work that way, people are evil, stupid, selfish, lazy, and cruel and most people who grow up come to understand that a six year old's fantasy cannot practically be applied in reality for these reasons. Those who don't grow up and realize it because they are stupid are communists. Every time communism has been tried in our world it has devolved into a horrific totalitarian state with millions dead. But some people never learn . I disagree. I am a socialist, yet consider myself a communist. I am authoritarian, meaning I believe in a strong government. I do not believe in the labor theory. Every able man should work. Capitalism is a primitive system, and the reason communism hasn't worked yet is because of Western imperialism. Communism was working fine in Cuba after Fidel's revolution until the fucking JFK administration killed millions of Cubans with the embargo, and blamed it on Castro. Want proof communism is stable economically? Take a good look at Cuba before the embargo. Death to the West!
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czechpatriarch
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Post by czechpatriarch on Aug 5, 2018 8:52:42 GMT
Communism is popular because it appeals to a six year old's dream of a Utopia where there's no government, no money, nobody is better than anyone else (no classes), and everybody owns everything together, everyone gets everything for free, and everybody gets along and helps one another and is one big happy family. Unfortunately the world doesn't work that way, people are evil, stupid, selfish, lazy, and cruel and most people who grow up come to understand that a six year old's fantasy cannot practically be applied in reality for these reasons. Those who don't grow up and realize it because they are stupid are communists. Every time communism has been tried in our world it has devolved into a horrific totalitarian state with millions dead. But some people never learn . I disagree. I am a socialist, yet consider myself a communist. I am authoritarian, meaning I believe in a strong government. I do not believe in the labor theory. Every able man should work. Capitalism is a primitive system, and the reason communism hasn't worked yet is because of Western imperialism. Communism was working fine in Cuba after Fidel's revolution until the fucking JFK administration killed millions of Cubans with the embargo, and blamed it on Castro. Want proof communism is stable economically? Take a good look at Cuba before the embargo. Death to the West! You say capitalism is primitive (i have lot of criticism of that system myself and usa by extension) yet communism/socialism never produced county able to compete with west economicaly. Soviet union was closest socialist state to west. Reason why communism didnt work is western imperialism? Thats total lie communism didnt work because its goal is unachievable. It always ends in dictatorship of "proletariat". After russian civil war soviet economy was so bad Lenin had to enact capitalist policy en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Economic_Policy to save Soviet economy. China also switched to market economy after Mao died
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Ace
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Post by Ace on Aug 5, 2018 13:17:41 GMT
I disagree. I am a socialist, yet consider myself a communist. I am authoritarian, meaning I believe in a strong government. I do not believe in the labor theory. Every able man should work. Capitalism is a primitive system, and the reason communism hasn't worked yet is because of Western imperialism. Communism was working fine in Cuba after Fidel's revolution until the fucking JFK administration killed millions of Cubans with the embargo, and blamed it on Castro. Want proof communism is stable economically? Take a good look at Cuba before the embargo. Death to the West! You say capitalism is primitive (i have lot of criticism of that system myself and usa by extension) yet communism/socialism never produced county able to compete with west economicaly. Soviet union was closest socialist state to west. Reason why communism didnt work is western imperialism? Thats total lie communism didnt work because its goal is unachievable. It always ends in dictatorship of "proletariat". After russian civil war soviet economy was so bad Lenin had to enact capitalist policy en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Economic_Policy to save Soviet economy. China also switched to market economy after Mao died If it weren't for the JFK administration's embargo, Cuba would have been a rival to the US. Why do you think they embargoed Cuba in the first place?
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czechpatriarch
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Post by czechpatriarch on Aug 5, 2018 14:25:32 GMT
You say capitalism is primitive (i have lot of criticism of that system myself and usa by extension) yet communism/socialism never produced county able to compete with west economicaly. Soviet union was closest socialist state to west. Reason why communism didnt work is western imperialism? Thats total lie communism didnt work because its goal is unachievable. It always ends in dictatorship of "proletariat". After russian civil war soviet economy was so bad Lenin had to enact capitalist policy en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Economic_Policy to save Soviet economy. China also switched to market economy after Mao died If it weren't for the JFK administration's embargo, Cuba would have been a rival to the US. Why do you think they embargoed Cuba in the first place? Rival to USA? :D (in what possible way). Reason why USA placed such high importance to owerthrowing Castro was Soviet desire to station missiles on Cuba and other possible military infrastructure. Tbh i still think cuba was better off during Castro than during batista era. But it still wouldnt rival USA.
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Ace
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Post by Ace on Aug 5, 2018 22:31:53 GMT
If it weren't for the JFK administration's embargo, Cuba would have been a rival to the US. Why do you think they embargoed Cuba in the first place? Rival to USA? :D (in what possible way). Reason why USA placed such high importance to owerthrowing Castro was Soviet desire to station missiles on Cuba and other possible military infrastructure. Tbh i still think cuba was better off during Castro than during batista era. But it still wouldnt rival USA. It would have been a challege at least. Despite my deep hatred for the JFK administration, I will say this: they were not stupid. They knew Cuba was growing economically, which is why they embargoed. As I highlighted, they wouldn't have done it otherwise.
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Ace
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Post by Ace on Aug 5, 2018 22:33:10 GMT
If it weren't for the JFK administration's embargo, Cuba would have been a rival to the US. Why do you think they embargoed Cuba in the first place? Rival to USA? :D (in what possible way). Reason why USA placed such high importance to owerthrowing Castro was Soviet desire to station missiles on Cuba and other possible military infrastructure. Tbh i still think cuba was better off during Castro than during batista era. But it still wouldnt rival USA. Anyway, I would just like to point out that saying communism doesn't work is like spraying water at wet paint and saying paint doesn't work.
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lyssyj
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Post by lyssyj on Aug 17, 2018 19:14:35 GMT
Communism is so popular due to: 1) it sucsessfuly criticizes capitalism 2) it has built-in tools for support people im difficult situations 3) it has better dream - no goverment, no money, no limits
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randomcj
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Post by randomcj on Aug 24, 2018 8:26:05 GMT
People are stupid, that’s why.
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Post by lupinate on Aug 26, 2018 8:37:02 GMT
Communism, like socialism, utilises several emotionally compelling semantic distortions. It claims it is for equality & fairness in society, and fails to highlight how it must be achieved. It also presumes political means are more viable for all than economic ones, a premise I could never understand.
Worst of all is its appeal to altruism. It expects all to be willing to sacrifice everything for the greater good, which then implies (to communists) its followers must be good people, for obviously they would be willing to sacrifice everything for the good of the whole. They ignore that they expect everyone else to sacrifice of themselves for them as individuals too, which makes them logically selfish in the extreme.
To me, it is simply full of boundless contradictions, which lead to endless pain for all.
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Post by lupinate on Oct 5, 2018 23:02:43 GMT
Because people are easily fooled into thinking "free at point of sale" means "without any cost".
No one is being taught logic these days outside stem, or what individualism actually means. And unfortunately we are all taught how irrational mankind is, so many therefore inaccurately presume that logical thought isn't applicable to our actions and our social structure.
They are wrong.
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