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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 29, 2018 22:10:39 GMT
Штат Македония. The state of Macedonia. A documentary about Macedonia I think many users here will be interesting this thread..
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2018 9:45:03 GMT
I will watch the video later today and let you know how accurate it is
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 30, 2018 16:33:49 GMT
I see that Americans are suspicious of the Macedonians and bet on Albanians!
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khaos
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Post by khaos on Apr 30, 2018 16:43:25 GMT
idiots
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 30, 2018 16:44:00 GMT
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2018 17:17:45 GMT
I see that Americans are suspicious of the Macedonians and bet on Albanians! I actually agree with the comment below USA and EU invested much more in Macedonia (I don't think Russia invested anything but propaganda material), and aren't explicitly against Macedonians. It would be foolish to side with Russia in their case. The reason why they moved the embassy probably had to do with the fact Macedonians burnt it during bombing of Yugoslavia.
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khaos
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Post by khaos on Apr 30, 2018 18:47:47 GMT
Well, tell that to those those morons who are protesting. Russia never helped Macedonia. Not even in the past, not even now. Russia never stood behind Macedonia. They support Serbia over our church dispute. They support Greece over our name dispute, even doe they recognized us. And now, when we finally decided to join NATO (you know, all those negotiations) they are interfering. Where was Russia in the war of 2001? Only Ukraine helped us. During Ottoman times, Russia helped Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia, but left Macedonia to the Ottomans. Most of these people who are protesting are Yugonostalgic commies, so it's not surprising, they are braindead. Also, one of their recent interferings....
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2018 19:15:26 GMT
Well, tell that to those those morons who are protesting. Russia never helped Macedonia. Not even in the past, not even now. Russia never stood behind Macedonia. They support Serbia over our church dispute. They support Greece over our name dispute, even doe they recognized us. And now, when we finally decided to join NATO (you know, all those negotiations) they are interfering. Where was Russia in the war of 2001? Only Ukraine helped us. During Ottoman times, Russia helped Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia, but left Macedonia to the Ottomans. Most of these people who are protesting are Yugonostalgic commies, so it's not surprising, they are braindead. Also, one of their recent interferings.... Church issue is for retarded people, to divert their attention from everyday misery. It is Russophiles in Serbia who think Russia helped Serbia the most during Ottoman times (I am not saying it didn't). The fact is Austro-Hungary helped the most. It even allowed regiments of their own cavalry to join Serbian forces. Current government in Serbia is made out of very incapable people so screeching and unrational thinking is indeed their thing. Yugoslavia was not bad for Macedonia.
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khaos
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Post by khaos on Apr 30, 2018 20:19:31 GMT
Dude, I am not religious, I don't even care about that. But what about those people who believe that Russians and Serbs are their "orthodox brothers"? Because of Serbia our church is not recognized by anyone, meanwhile Croatia as a Catholic country let two Macedonian orthodox churches to be built there, and the religious patriots here like Serbia and Russia more than Croatia, why is that? Sometimes they even side up with Serbs insulting Croats calling them "ustase" in order to offend them, what a bunch of morons. Well, that's the thing. There's a reason why people in Serbia are russophillic, why are people in Macedonia russophillic? The answer is - Serbian influence. Yugoslavia was cancer for Macedonia, since most of our intelligentsia was murdered/imprisoned during Tito's reign. But hey, no one cares about that, as long as you lived by the motto "Brotherhood and Unity", yeah we saw how that turned out after Tito's death.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2018 20:49:35 GMT
Dude, I am not religious, I don't even care about that. But what about those people who believe that Russians and Serbs are their "orthodox brothers"? I consider such people dangerous. However, you are Slavs, and so you should have positive feelings towards Russia because (so far!) they haven't done nothing bad to Macedonia. They also have problem because apart from Putin, Lavrov and few other old school politicians they are ruled by incompetent people pretty much as Serbia and Macedonia are. You don't know Croats really well, you are still somewhat inexperienced with them Agreed. Putting all people under the same label is juvenile and incorrect. Well many Macedonians have part of their families (more or less distant) in Serbia, so Macedonia is to a degree influenced by Serbia. That's normal under such conditions. It has to do with Balkans as environment, nothing specific to SFR Yugoslavia. The same happened in Serbia. Topcider forest park in Belgrade is place where 30 000 Serbs were killed (mostly acamedics, doctors etc because they didn't take part in partisan movement). During WW2 Bulgarians did the same in Macedonia. What happened after Tito's death (I'm assuming you talk about breakup) was indeed consequence of politics which was based more on opinions and emotions - instinct in other words - than knowledge. That's what happens when instincts prevails.
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khaos
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Post by khaos on Apr 30, 2018 21:06:40 GMT
How about no. Just because we belong to the Slavic-speaking "family" tree doesn't mean we need to have positive things towards Russia or any other Slavic nation. They did enough bad by doing nothing.
Yeah well Croats and Macedonian worked together long time against the Serbian regime during the Kingdom of SCS. Croats, who according to most Serbs are "enemies" to orthodoxy, let two Macedonian churches to be built there, how many Macedonian churches are in Serbia? Oh wait, they don't even recognize ours, I wonder why... And just because you have bad relations with the Croats (in the past and now) doesn't mean that we should too just because you don't like them, but hey there are some people who think like that here, be happy.
The only "Macedonians" that have part of their families in Serbia are the ones that are descendants of the Serbian colonists that came here during the Serbian occupation of Vardar Macedonia between the two world wars.
>During WW2 Bulgarians did the same in Macedonia. what?
And no I was talking about the unnecessary wars that happened after Tito's death. According to you (Serbs), you joined the war because you wanted to keep Yugoslavia together, while all the other countries wanted independence. You didn't let that, so we saw what happened. Yugoslavia was just a mask for greater Serbia - fact, no matter how much you deny it...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2018 21:32:24 GMT
How about no. Just because we belong to the Slavic-speaking "family" tree doesn't mean we need to have positive things towards Russia or any other Slavic nation. They did enough bad by doing nothing. What you just shown here is prejudice. Not a good quality for young person such as yourself. These groups (Ustase and VMRO) were fascist and were supported by Mussolini whose only goal was to take seizable part of Yugoslavia. I don't equalize whole nation with couple of individuals here. For a non-religious person you mention church too much. Absolutely not! I don't think Croats, are bad in general. I have a lot of Croatian friends. However, Serbs and Croats have history. I guarantee you the existence of Macedonians in Serbia is real and they moved to Serbia during Yugoslav era. They don't have Serbian surnames. Exactly what I wrote. I've been told this by more than one Macedonian. There are different speculations, so I don't know the exact reasons for war. But I know the following: Serbian political leadership and a part of population made a wrong estimate back then.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 30, 2018 22:21:06 GMT
In this video, says that after the collapse of Yugoslavia, Macedonia became backward and exists on Western money...Americans guard their embassy in order not to repeat the events of 1999!
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Post by Διαμονδ on Apr 30, 2018 22:26:51 GMT
Dude, I am not religious, I don't even care about that. But what about those people who believe that Russians and Serbs are their "orthodox brothers"? Because of Serbia our church is not recognized by anyone, meanwhile Croatia as a Catholic country let two Macedonian orthodox churches to be built there, and the religious patriots here like Serbia and Russia more than Croatia, why is that? Sometimes they even side up with Serbs insulting Croats calling them "ustase" in order to offend them, what a bunch of morons. Well, that's the thing. There's a reason why people in Serbia are russophillic, why are people in Macedonia russophillic? The answer is - Serbian influence. Yugoslavia was cancer for Macedonia, since most of our intelligentsia was murdered/imprisoned during Tito's reign. But hey, no one cares about that, as long as you lived by the motto "Brotherhood and Unity", yeah we saw how that turned out after Tito's death. After the collapse of Yugoslavia, you have become worse situation! War of 2001 for example .. You have 2 ways out of the situation - either back to new -Yugoslavia or to brothers from Bulgaria!
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khaos
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Post by khaos on May 1, 2018 8:31:18 GMT
@the Big Bad Wolf I am surprised you didn't call me a nazi, well well well...
Hhehehe. These groups fought for their independence, for their people. Why did the want independence, anyway? There must've been something wrong during Karadjordjevic's regime since he was killed like the dog he truly was..
Yeah well, I used to be quite religious. I am not against Christianity, there are other reasons why I became non-religious, but that was not the point of my comment you quoted.
And that history is between you two, unfortunately there are morons here who think they'll achieve something by siding up with you.
Those are Serbomans, "Macedonians in Serbia" my ass.. keep them there, we don't need them here.
"Exactly what I wrote. I've been told this by more than one Macedonian." Then apparently those Macedonians who told you this are retarded and brainwashed. We were liberated by the German army from the Serbian occupation, and the Germans were welcomed as liberators. The administration of Macedonia was given to Bulgarians, and we should've gotten independence just like Croatia did (NDH). By the way, 2/3 of the Bulgarian soldiers in Macedonia were born here, including my great-grandfather.
Yeah yeah, "different speculations".
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