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Post by DKTrav88 on Feb 13, 2018 8:40:43 GMT
The doctrine of salvation is often discussion among Christians on and off the internet, but it is obvious that there is a divide in what Christians believe salvation is and how to achieve it. One argument is that we are saved by our good works, our repenting of our sins, and our keeping of the law. While another argument is that we are saved by faith and by faith only. And a third argument is that we are saved by both faith and works, but which one of these is true? There are also other disagreements in the doctrine of salvation as many believe it is possible to lose our salvation once we are saved and others believe it is impossible to lose our salvation, but which one is true? The best we can do is to refer ourselves to the scriptures as God's word is all that we have to tell us what the truth is. Based on your reading of the scriptures, which doctrine of salvation do you believe is true doctrine? Please use scripture to support your belief.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Feb 14, 2018 10:45:14 GMT
But those things which God foretold by the mouth of all His prophets, that the Christ would suffer, He has thus fulfilled. Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that He may send Jesus Christ, who was preached to you before, whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began. (Acts 3:18–24) I would say that it is quite simple! That is, the essence of the Old Testament was the preparation for Christ and his salvation which was not there before! If salvation is possible without Christ, but only with such faith as Abraham, then Christ would not have come ... God simply said lyudyam- Be like Abraham and your faith will save you!- I think it's logical!
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Post by DKTrav88 on Feb 14, 2018 10:51:02 GMT
The faith of Abraham is faith in God's promise. The belief that him will have a son and will have descendants and the belief that he will be saved at the right time! The Mechanism of Salvation, you know the essence! If you think smarter than millions of generations of Christians, then I will tell you this: For there will be a time when sound doctrine will not be accepted, but by their whims they will elect teachers for themselves that would flatter their ears; 4and they turn away the ears from the truth, and turn to fables. The Second Epistle of Timothy CHAPTER 4.Saved at the right time? Let me ask you this.. what do you think Abraham's bosom is in Luke 16? You know I could just as easily flip 2 Timothy 4:3-4 around on you facepalm
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Post by Διαμονδ on Feb 14, 2018 11:02:01 GMT
The faith of Abraham is faith in God's promise. The belief that him will have a son and will have descendants and the belief that he will be saved at the right time! The Mechanism of Salvation, you know the essence! If you think smarter than millions of generations of Christians, then I will tell you this: For there will be a time when sound doctrine will not be accepted, but by their whims they will elect teachers for themselves that would flatter their ears; 4and they turn away the ears from the truth, and turn to fables. The Second Epistle of Timothy CHAPTER 4.Saved at the right time? Let me ask you this.. what do you think Abraham's bosom is in Luke 16? You know I could just as easily flip 2 Timothy 4:3-4 around on you Christ the prophet - He could predict the future in his parables! Even if he spoke in the literal sense! facepalm -Timothy 4:3-4 around on you- ???? I just follow the rules to the millions of Christians who were before me! I follow the teachings of the Church Fathers who have laid down the biblical canon en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon - you believe the Bible, but you do not believe the doctrine of those who put the scriptures in one book!
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Post by Elizabeth on Feb 14, 2018 11:04:22 GMT
Truly my soul finds rest in God; my salvation comes from Him. Psalm 62:1
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Post by DKTrav88 on Feb 14, 2018 11:08:32 GMT
Saved at the right time? Let me ask you this.. what do you think Abraham's bosom is in Luke 16? You know I could just as easily flip 2 Timothy 4:3-4 around on you Christ the prophet - He could predict the future in his parables! Even if he spoke in the literal sense! -Timothy 4:3-4 around on you- ???? I just follow the rules to the millions of Christians who were before me! I follow the teachings of the Church Fathers who have laid down the biblical canon en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon - you believe the Bible, but you do not believe the doctrine of those who put the scriptures in one book! So what is Abraham's bosom? You think Abraham's bosom is Christ the prophet? I thought Christ was the Messiah. Can you elaborate? "I just follow the rules to the millions of Christians who were before me!" I think that's your problem there, how do you know they were right if you don't read the rules God laid out for us first? "I follow the teachings of the Church Fathers who have laid down the biblical canon" Oh okay, it makes sense now. You follow the traditions of men.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Feb 14, 2018 11:19:53 GMT
Christ the prophet - He could predict the future in his parables! Even if he spoke in the literal sense! -Timothy 4:3-4 around on you- ???? I just follow the rules to the millions of Christians who were before me! I follow the teachings of the Church Fathers who have laid down the biblical canon en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon - you believe the Bible, but you do not believe the doctrine of those who put the scriptures in one book! So what is Abraham's bosom? You think Abraham's bosom is Christ the prophet? I thought Christ was the Messiah. Can you elaborate? "I just follow the rules to the millions of Christians who were before me!" I think that's your problem there, how do you know they were right if you don't read the rules God laid out for us first? "I follow the teachings of the Church Fathers who have laid down the biblical canon" Oh okay, it makes sense now. You follow the traditions of men. Abraham's bosom? This is one of the mysterious places in Scripture that is difficult to explain to a common person! -The concept of paradise is not mentioned in Luke 16, nor are any of the distinguishing Jewish associations of paradise such as Third Heaven (found with "paradise" in 2 Corinthians 12:2–4 and Apocalypse of Moses), or the tree of life (found with "paradise" in Genesis 2:8 Septuagint and Book of Revelation 2:7). Consequently, identification of Bosom of Abraham with Paradise is contested. It is not clear whether Matthew 8:11 "And I tell you that many will come from the East and West and will eat with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven." represents an alternative or complimentary cosmology to the ideas of Luke 16:19–31.- en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosom_of_Abraham Yes Jesus is the Messiah but among the functions of Messiah the gift of the prophet!
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Post by Διαμονδ on Feb 14, 2018 11:21:47 GMT
-Oh okay, it makes sense now. You follow the traditions of men.- Which denomination do you belong to?
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Post by DKTrav88 on Feb 14, 2018 11:34:53 GMT
So what is Abraham's bosom? You think Abraham's bosom is Christ the prophet? I thought Christ was the Messiah. Can you elaborate? "I just follow the rules to the millions of Christians who were before me!" I think that's your problem there, how do you know they were right if you don't read the rules God laid out for us first? "I follow the teachings of the Church Fathers who have laid down the biblical canon" Oh okay, it makes sense now. You follow the traditions of men. Abraham's bosom? This is one of the mysterious places in Scripture that is difficult to explain to a common person! -The concept of paradise is not mentioned in Luke 16, nor are any of the distinguishing Jewish associations of paradise such as Third Heaven (found with "paradise" in 2 Corinthians 12:2–4 and Apocalypse of Moses), or the tree of life (found with "paradise" in Genesis 2:8 Septuagint and Book of Revelation 2:7). Consequently, identification of Bosom of Abraham with Paradise is contested. It is not clear whether Matthew 8:11 "And I tell you that many will come from the East and West and will eat with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven." represents an alternative or complimentary cosmology to the ideas of Luke 16:19–31.- en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosom_of_Abraham Yes Jesus is the Messiah but among the functions of Messiah the gift of the prophet!
Do you know what a bosom is?
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Post by DKTrav88 on Feb 14, 2018 11:35:41 GMT
-Oh okay, it makes sense now. You follow the traditions of men.- Which denomination do you belong to? I don't claim to belong to any denomination. If I were forced to pick one, it would be baptist.
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Post by Elizabeth on Feb 19, 2018 1:28:27 GMT
When people pray to saints, the saints can't do nothing at all. They will not pray for your behalf or help you in any way. Only Jesus in heaven can. Otherwise you're wasting your time praying to saints and not trusting in Jesus' power alone. Jesus loved to say, "O ye of little faith. "No one can come to the Father except through me.” (John 14:6) Praying to saints is saying they can come to the Father in more ways than one. But there is only one way.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Feb 19, 2018 8:12:29 GMT
When people pray to saints, the saints can't do nothing at all. They will not pray for your behalf or help you in any way. Only Jesus in heaven can. Otherwise you're wasting your time praying to saints and not trusting in Jesus' power alone. Jesus loved to say, "O ye of little faith. "No one can come to the Father except through me.” (John 14:6) Praying to saints is saying they can come to the Father in more ways than one. But there is only one way. Saints are the righteous - because the eyes of the Lord are toward the righteous, and his ears to their prayer 1 Peter 3:12 According to the Scriptures, the opinions of the righteous are important to God! As I already wrote for God there are no living or dead, we are the whole body of Christ and if the body of Christ on earth is praying for each other, then in heaven they continue to do this! In any case, this is a matter of faith! Nothing more!
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Post by Elizabeth on Feb 19, 2018 8:17:10 GMT
When people pray to saints, the saints can't do nothing at all. They will not pray for your behalf or help you in any way. Only Jesus in heaven can. Otherwise you're wasting your time praying to saints and not trusting in Jesus' power alone. Jesus loved to say, "O ye of little faith. "No one can come to the Father except through me.” (John 14:6) Praying to saints is saying they can come to the Father in more ways than one. But there is only one way. Saints are the righteous - because the eyes of the Lord are toward the righteous, and his ears to their prayer 1 Peter 3:12 According to the Scriptures, the opinions of the righteous are important to God! As I already wrote for God there are no living or dead, we are the whole body of Christ and if the body of Christ on earth is praying for each other, then in heaven they continue to do this! In any case, this is a matter of faith! Nothing more! Yes, we have saints on earth and in heaven. But let's say one saint on earth prays to another saint on earth. Do you think the saint hears it? No. He's not all knowing and can't answer prayer. Only God can answer our prayers. Not even angels can answer our prayers. Only God.
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Post by Διαμονδ on Feb 19, 2018 8:21:16 GMT
Saints are the righteous - because the eyes of the Lord are toward the righteous, and his ears to their prayer 1 Peter 3:12 According to the Scriptures, the opinions of the righteous are important to God! As I already wrote for God there are no living or dead, we are the whole body of Christ and if the body of Christ on earth is praying for each other, then in heaven they continue to do this! In any case, this is a matter of faith! Nothing more! Yes, we have saints on earth and in heaven. But let's say one saint on earth prays to another saint on earth. Do you think the saint hears it? No. He's not all knowing and can't answer prayer. Only God can answer our prayers. Not even angels can answer our prayers. Only God. I support the views of the apostle Paul in relation to women! All according to the Bible!))
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Post by Elizabeth on Feb 19, 2018 8:36:17 GMT
Yes, we have saints on earth and in heaven. But let's say one saint on earth prays to another saint on earth. Do you think the saint hears it? No. He's not all knowing and can't answer prayer. Only God can answer our prayers. Not even angels can answer our prayers. Only God. I support the views of the apostle Paul in relation to women! All according to the Bible!)) We are not talking about women here. But I support women keeping quiet in church too. I'm not stupid to preach in church
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